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      12-03-2019, 12:44 PM   #246
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Drives: 2018 M5
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Originally Posted by drgmt View Post
Originally Posted by andrewsd View Post
Originally Posted by drgmt View Post
Originally Posted by andrewsd View Post
Originally Posted by kyrix1st View Post
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
It's likely that Mercedes will eventually kill their DCT offerings as well. If their DCT is outshined by BMW's automatic, will the fact that they offer DCT really matters that much?!?!
The cold fact is that it just doesn't.

BMW had perfect transmission called M-DCT and if they are phasing out on the purest M variants just for cost cutting, there is no future for this company. At least not for M division.
People keep saying it's because of cost cutting, is it really? Source?

It might be because the ZF8 shift just as quick but is superior as a dual purpose transmission, which is what M cars are. It's more efficient, smoother when you're not hammering it, and when it counts just as quick.

And for what it's worth I think the M2/M3 should keep the DCT, it's a more dramatic/fun transmission and feels special. But the zf makes sense on more than just cost.
Buying power, production line costs writing software for one hardware platform. Basic business principles.
Thank you for explaining to me "basic business principles"

I understand it's cheaper. I'm not arguing that. I'm arguing if that was the deciding factor in bringing it to the F90 and ultimately the g80.

I think cost was one of many things they considered and with performance very near the DCT, better low speed drivability, along with other performance cars using the ZF, you could make the argument that it made sense for the mixed use of an M car.

However, with that being said, their halo car the M8 is basically an M5... and all the interiors look the same... and every trim has the same steering wheel and the same digital dash and etc... so maybe you're right.
I apologise for sounding condescending. It wasn't my intention. But this is purely a cost issue.

If Mercedes pushes on with a DCT in an A class, I think its poor form for an M car to follow the masses in its segment.

Mercedes - Alfa - better engine, Better
Exhaust and in the case of Mercedes Better interior. Why buy an M?

What an M car had over these cars was driving dynamics. The DCT is a massive part of this winning formula. With a ZF it will lose that dynamic driving advantage.

I drove a Alfa quadrafoglio a week ago and all the journos raving about the ZF box must have driving a different car - it was terrible and no where near as good as our DCT.
Fair points. There is no denying the car feels more special with a DCT. I remember going from my Audi S5 to an M4 and the DCT made the car feel unique. It made it more exciting to drive. I loved it.

And with the GT500 and C8 going DCT it's a shame BMW M is moving away from it.

I still believe the ZF makes sense in the M5 with is luxury attributes. But M2/M3, any CS variant should keep a DCT.

I haven't driven the Alfa yet.