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      12-23-2019, 02:31 PM   #259
First Lieutenant
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United Kingdom

Drives: 2017 M4 ZCP (DCT)
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: San Francisco

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Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
I think I figured out part of the differences in opinion here. The ZF8 is adaptive in its reaction times. If I shift during normal driving the transmission takes longer to react and the shift does not complete for as much as a 1/4 second. During full throttle situations is reacts faster and the complete shift occurs before the shifter/paddle returns to the neutral position.
I guess my adverse reactions from driving ZF8 cars is that having the car second guess when I want a fast shift is really annoying. It isn't just when I have the throttle pedal nailed to the floor... in fact, it's most likely when I'm braking into a corner and need the shift to happen before turn-in, or when I'm thinking about overtaking and want to be in a responsive gear *before* I hit the gas. Both of these situations are *downshifts* and not full-throttle (though I guess some people are happy to rely on kickdown for the overtaking scenario - personally it scares the $hit of of me to mash the throttle and not know when the car is going to start moving).

Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
One other important piece is to differentiate between reaction time and shift times. Shift times are very quick with the ZF8, but the reaction times can be slow or fast depending on the situation.
The DCT boxes also do this to some extent... rev-matching delays are variable. But it definitely *starts* blipping the throttle for a downshift as soon as I hit the paddle. I didn't feel like this was true on an X3M. Haven't had chance to drive an M5Comp yet (but the M8 comp track videos shows noticeable delays)

Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
Either way the ZF is not a visceral as the DCT due to both programming (designed for near zero break in TQ application) and the mechanical nature of DCT. This is disappearing from almost every vehicle in every input (steering, shifting, brakes, throttle, ride quality). It is not unique to the M3 or even BMW.
Very True.
SD ///M42227.50