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2019+ BMW 3 AND 4-SERIES FORUMS (G2x Generation) General G80 M3 / G82 M4 Forum (2019+) Concerned about the S58 after drag racing in an X3M/X4M

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      08-18-2019, 11:24 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Miko M View Post
Did they pass the 1st services at 1200mil?
If not you can't launch them yet.

Second it's a heavy car but, it should never take 5 sec. Something is wrong there!!!!

M3/4 should launch like this video below.
Mine F90 M5
I just hade full Eisenmann exhaust and intake and RC ( later I added DME full tune )

Interesting ... I counted at least 5 shifts - amazed that you end up needing such high gears on a 'launch'?

Looks like the power band is really narrow at the top end and the ratios are really close? (The car is shifting much more frequently than I would have expected - something that makes sense in a full-auto 8spd but is not going to be great when driving in 'manual' mode) Maybe this is due to the tune?
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      08-19-2019, 01:49 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by pbar View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miko M View Post
Did they pass the 1st services at 1200mil?
If not you can't launch them yet.

Second it's a heavy car but, it should never take 5 sec. Something is wrong there!!!!

M3/4 should launch like this video below.
Mine F90 M5
I just hade full Eisenmann exhaust and intake and RC ( later I added DME full tune )

Interesting ... I counted at least 5 shifts - amazed that you end up needing such high gears on a 'launch'?

Looks like the power band is really narrow at the top end and the ratios are really close? (The car is shifting much more frequently than I would have expected - something that makes sense in a full-auto 8spd but is not going to be great when driving in 'manual' mode) Maybe this is due to the tune?
Not sure what you mean high gear on a launch?

Yes it was 5 shifts and very quick shifts for one the gear ratio and second it has the power to reach them much quicker.

At the last shift point I believe I was at 130mph
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      08-19-2019, 07:02 PM   #25
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At the last shift point I believe I was at 130mph
That explains it ;-) Thanks
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      08-20-2019, 01:36 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pbar View Post
Interesting ... I counted at least 5 shifts - amazed that you end up needing such high gears on a 'launch'?

Looks like the power band is really narrow at the top end and the ratios are really close? (The car is shifting much more frequently than I would have expected - something that makes sense in a full-auto 8spd but is not going to be great when driving in 'manual' mode) Maybe this is due to the tune?
That's preferential difference, revving out each gear with relatively longer gear ratio of 7-DCT or quick initial acceleration from shorter gears like the ZF8.

That being said, I'm confident that both being stock, F10 M5 comp will edge F90 out slightly on the top end in a rolling race due to a less drivetrain drag being purely RWD.
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      08-21-2019, 03:32 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miko M View Post
Did they pass the 1st services at 1200mil?
If not you can't launch them yet.

Second it's a heavy car but, it should never take 5 sec. Something is wrong there!!!!

M3/4 should launch like this video below.
Mine F90 M5
I just hade full Eisenmann exhaust and intake and RC ( later I added DME full tune )

To have launch control enabled a M340i would need to go to BMW to get services and they enable the launch mode?
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      08-21-2019, 03:46 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miko M View Post
Did they pass the 1st services at 1200mil?
If not you can't launch them yet.

Second it's a heavy car but, it should never take 5 sec. Something is wrong there!!!!

M3/4 should launch like this video below.
Mine F90 M5
I just hade full Eisenmann exhaust and intake and RC ( later I added DME full tune )

To have launch control enabled a M340i would need to go to BMW to get services and they enable the launch mode?
No, you should be able to use it in this order:



Launch Control is available when the engine is at operating temperature. The engine is at operating temperature after an uninterrupted trip of at least 6 miles/10 km.

*Start with launch control*



- Press the button. TRACTION is displayed in the instrument cluster and the indicator light for DSC OFF lights up.

- Engage selector lever position S.

- With the left foot, forcefully press down on the brake.

- Press and hold down the accelerator pedal beyond the resistance point at the full throttle position, kick down. A flag symbol is displayed in the instrument cluster.

- The starting engine speed adjusts. Within 3 seconds, release the break.

Have fun
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      08-21-2019, 10:29 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pbar View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miko M View Post
Did they pass the 1st services at 1200mil?
If not you can't launch them yet.

Second it's a heavy car but, it should never take 5 sec. Something is wrong there!!!!

M3/4 should launch like this video below.
Mine F90 M5
I just hade full Eisenmann exhaust and intake and RC ( later I added DME full tune )

Interesting ... I counted at least 5 shifts - amazed that you end up needing such high gears on a 'launch'?

Looks like the power band is really narrow at the top end and the ratios are really close? (The car is shifting much more frequently than I would have expected - something that makes sense in a full-auto 8spd but is not going to be great when driving in 'manual' mode) Maybe this is due to the tune?
At least 5 shifts? It was 4 which is easy to count because of the gear indicator front and center! FYI.
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      08-22-2019, 05:19 PM   #30
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I'm assuming 5 seconds is a great exaggeration since the 0-60 on these cars is better than that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by trey100 View Post
I'm assuming 5 seconds is a great exaggeration since the 0-60 on these cars is better than that.
The 0-60 times from BMW are from launch control. I guarantee you this guy didn't launch.. I just finished the M town tour and was incredibly underwhelmed with the X3MC. You're not allowed to launch the vehicle and if I had to guess, it was close to 5 seconds 0-60. I had a test drive at Audi right after and drove the RS5 sport back and it was unbelievably faster off the line / overall and 1000% more fun to drive. I'm comparing apples to oranges on that, but they're almost identical price. Too bad Audi's lease programs are as bad as they come or I would probably make the switch. Let's hope the new M3 doesn't have that insane lag and is more competitive to the RS5.
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      08-22-2019, 11:16 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parzy21 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by trey100 View Post
I'm assuming 5 seconds is a great exaggeration since the 0-60 on these cars is better than that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by trey100 View Post
I'm assuming 5 seconds is a great exaggeration since the 0-60 on these cars is better than that.
The 0-60 times from BMW are from launch control. I guarantee you this guy didn't launch.. I just finished the M town tour and was incredibly underwhelmed with the X3MC. You're not allowed to launch the vehicle and if I had to guess, it was close to 5 seconds 0-60. I had a test drive at Audi right after and drove the RS5 sport back and it was unbelievably faster off the line / overall and 1000% more fun to drive. I'm comparing apples to oranges on that, but they're almost identical price. Too bad Audi's lease programs are as bad as they come or I would probably make the switch. Let's hope the new M3 doesn't have that insane lag and is more competitive to the RS5.
RS5 is beautiful inside and out... for a street car i would strongly consider one but since I would want to track it, kinda shuts it down. I don't have the scratch to have such a nice street car with another decent track toy. Bummer!

Weird tho that the RS5 felt SO much faster than the X3M.. figured they'd be comparable under similar conditions. Of course the RS5 is a car so it should spank a small SUV but these are crazy times too. RS6 is coming too .... yum.
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      09-15-2019, 08:29 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nirvanayoda View Post
At an event, we drag raced an X3M and X4M. Both of those cars had a huge delay after flooring before the boost kicked in. Basically, you floored it and then it was like "go slowly, go slowly, count to 5, then boom acceleration". I was told that it's a known design choice associated with the turbos on those SUVs to make them feel more like an "X" vehicle, and that the turbos in the M3/M4 will fix this problem.

Has anyone else experienced this, and do we know if the turbos in the M3/M4 will indeed resolve this issue?
If you're not doing launch control or at least brake standing you don't have enough boost. That's the lag you experienced.
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      09-15-2019, 09:02 AM   #33
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Correct. I noted as much above. Itís probably much less than 5 seconds. I was just trying to get the point across that it feels like forever.
Indeed, using hyperbole to get your point across is a well understood device, unfortunately everyone suddenly becomes obtuse when they log on to the internet.
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      10-06-2019, 07:59 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xlover View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by evanescent03 View Post
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Originally Posted by isaywhateveryo View Post
We were not allowed to use launch control, so this was just flooring it. I did put the throttle setting in Sport+ or whatever the max was on the model (I think it was Sport+ like it is in my M4). And I'm probably exaggerating about the 5 seconds, but it was a long enough lag for everyone that I talked to take notice. Maybe more like 3? It just felt like eternity.

But as I noted, the guy in charge told me that the M3/M4 would be much different. Maybe the poster above is right — these are geared to make sure that the trip to Home Depot isn't violent (given that they are SUVs after all).
I think it has more to do with the turbos spooling and the transmission making sure it's in the right gear. NA cars have instant response when punching it, turbo cars don't. I remember one of the motor trend guys talking about how a Prius could beat a Nissan GTR off the line if launch control wasn't being used because you wait, wait, wait, and then light speed.... same thing here. Same thing in my M6, M3s, X1, S3, Jeep Wrangler (new turbo), and the list goes on... a more modest press on the pedal gets it rolling sooner but if you just jam it down, usually a weird delay.
The majority of the x3m reviews at the launch event commented that there was minimal to no true turbo lag from this motor which leads me to lean towards what OP was told, the software programming around throttle tip in being "softer" for the suv than they would setup for an M3.

the previous gen S55 displayed very little if any lag and it's unlikely bmw would go backwards in this respect. The B58 was an improvement over the N55 so my expectation is all things being equal the S58 will be an improvement over the S55.
Not sure if you're implying using launch control, but there is hesitation/lag with every one of my S55 equipped cars. 16 F82, 19 F87, 2 18 F80's and 18 F80CS. Also in my F85 and F30.
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      10-07-2019, 05:05 PM   #35
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Not sure if you're implying using launch control, but there is hesitation/lag with every one of my S55 equipped cars. 16 F82, 19 F87, 2 18 F80's and 18 F80CS. Also in my F85 and F30.
there is hesitation and lag in every turbo engine

it's a characteristic of how it works
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      10-07-2019, 07:45 PM   #36
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xlover View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by evanescent03 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by isaywhateveryo View Post
We were not allowed to use launch control, so this was just flooring it. I did put the throttle setting in Sport+ or whatever the max was on the model (I think it was Sport+ like it is in my M4). And I'm probably exaggerating about the 5 seconds, but it was a long enough lag for everyone that I talked to take notice. Maybe more like 3? It just felt like eternity.

But as I noted, the guy in charge told me that the M3/M4 would be much different. Maybe the poster above is right — these are geared to make sure that the trip to Home Depot isn't violent (given that they are SUVs after all).
I think it has more to do with the turbos spooling and the transmission making sure it's in the right gear. NA cars have instant response when punching it, turbo cars don't. I remember one of the motor trend guys talking about how a Prius could beat a Nissan GTR off the line if launch control wasn't being used because you wait, wait, wait, and then light speed.... same thing here. Same thing in my M6, M3s, X1, S3, Jeep Wrangler (new turbo), and the list goes on... a more modest press on the pedal gets it rolling sooner but if you just jam it down, usually a weird delay.
The majority of the x3m reviews at the launch event commented that there was minimal to no true turbo lag from this motor which leads me to lean towards what OP was told, the software programming around throttle tip in being "softer" for the suv than they would setup for an M3.

the previous gen S55 displayed very little if any lag and it's unlikely bmw would go backwards in this respect. The B58 was an improvement over the N55 so my expectation is all things being equal the S58 will be an improvement over the S55.
Not sure if you're implying using launch control, but there is hesitation/lag with every one of my S55 equipped cars. 16 F82, 19 F87, 2 18 F80's and 18 F80CS. Also in my F85 and F30.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by paliknight View Post
Not sure if you're implying using launch control, but there is hesitation/lag with every one of my S55 equipped cars. 16 F82, 19 F87, 2 18 F80's and 18 F80CS. Also in my F85 and F30.
there is hesitation and lag in every turbo engine

it's a characteristic of how it works
One must admit, though, that the S55 does a great job of masking much of the lag. It is a very responsive engine.
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      10-07-2019, 10:40 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by paliknight View Post
Not sure if you're implying using launch control, but there is hesitation/lag with every one of my S55 equipped cars. 16 F82, 19 F87, 2 18 F80's and 18 F80CS. Also in my F85 and F30.
there is hesitation and lag in every turbo engine

it's a characteristic of how it works
I do not have that issue in my TTS (991).
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      10-08-2019, 07:02 AM   #38
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One must admit, though, that the S55 does a great job of masking much of the lag. It is a very responsive engine.
Definitely, it is very responsive. As far as turbo engines go it's excellent
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      10-08-2019, 07:03 AM   #39
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I do not have that issue in my TTS (991).
All turbo engines have lag. That's why they're working on electric turbos.
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      10-08-2019, 08:56 AM   #40
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I do not have that issue in my TTS (991).
All turbo engines have lag. That's why they're working on electric turbos.
If it lags, I don't feel it. When I hit the gas, its response is instant. As opposed to my M cars where there's a few seconds of "oh shit I'm fucked" while merging from a dig onto a highway.
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      10-08-2019, 09:01 AM   #41
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If it lags, I don't feel it. When I hit the gas, its response is instant. As opposed to my M cars where there's a few seconds of "oh shit I'm fucked" while merging from a dig onto a highway.
A few seconds of lag? Something must be wrong with your cars.

Next time I instruct a student in a 991 TT I'll make sure to pay attention to the instant throttle response
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      10-08-2019, 09:33 AM   #42
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Originally Posted by paliknight View Post
If it lags, I don't feel it. When I hit the gas, its response is instant. As opposed to my M cars where there's a few seconds of "oh shit I'm fucked" while merging from a dig onto a highway.
A few seconds of lag? Something must be wrong with your cars.

Next time I instruct a student in a 991 TT I'll make sure to pay attention to the instant throttle response
This is without launch control. You do that. I'm stating my experience in all these vehicles that I've owned and daily driven. Not track driven. I loved all cars so I'm not biased towards any of them. Look thru the forum and you'll see other members have similar experiences. It might not be turbo lag, but there is a response delay when you're stopped, then slam the accelerator all of a sudden. That's what I'm referring to.
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      10-08-2019, 09:55 AM   #43
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This is without launch control. You do that. I'm stating my experience in all these vehicles that I've owned and daily driven. Not track driven. I loved all cars so I'm not biased towards any of them. Look thru the forum and you'll see other members have similar experiences. It might not be turbo lag, but there is a response delay when you're stopped, then slam the accelerator all of a sudden. That's what I'm referring to.
I've never used launch control.
I do drive on the street but most of my experience comes from the track where the S55 is quite responsive. Not the S65 but still quite good
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      10-08-2019, 10:10 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by paliknight View Post
This is without launch control. You do that. I'm stating my experience in all these vehicles that I've owned and daily driven. Not track driven. I loved all cars so I'm not biased towards any of them. Look thru the forum and you'll see other members have similar experiences. It might not be turbo lag, but there is a response delay when you're stopped, then slam the accelerator all of a sudden. That's what I'm referring to.
I've never used launch control.
I do drive on the street but most of my experience comes from the track where the S55 is quite responsive. Not the S65 but still quite good
It's very responsive once it gets going. My only gripe is when you're stopped then merge onto a highway, so you spread the accelerator all the way and it takes a second or two for the car to register that you want to take off. Once it realizes though it's very responsive after that. It's as if the car is used to you driving like a grandma, then doesn't expect you to gun it.
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