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2019+ BMW 3 AND 4-SERIES FORUMS (G2x Generation) General G80 M3 Sedan Forum (2019+) BMW "M xDrive" Coming to the next generation M3 / M4?

View Poll Results: AWD?
Yes, AWD M3/M4 like the F90 M5 198 63.26%
No, keep it RWD 76 24.28%
Either way is cool with me 39 12.46%
Voters: 313. You may not vote on this poll

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      05-24-2017, 11:01 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
In my not so humble opinion you are overthinking it.

At the end of the day I put the chances of a G** M3/M4 with AWD very low, and the chances of the same with a *206 "C63" (or whatever they call it) staying RWD at essentially zero.
huh, well I can't argue with that. Not that I don't want to.
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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
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      05-24-2017, 09:39 PM   #46
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M just dropped another video - they're pushing the xdrive hard

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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
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      05-25-2017, 06:01 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by RACEM4TE View Post
Not next gen but the one after it.
I thought the next^2 one is going to be at least a hybrid if not all electric...

Last edited by Skid123; 05-25-2017 at 06:08 PM..
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      05-26-2017, 05:24 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrussGott View Post
I guess my question is how much AMG and M compete now that they're separate car lines from their parent companies ... obviously if one of them really falls behind in value it'll cause switching, but there are some features I don't think they compete in much.

Take 'verts: is AMG really trying to steal BMW M 'vert customers? Or are trying to create a new segment of Benz buyers? I suspect it's the latter. AWD seems the same to me - is BMW really trying to protect against customer loss or would the primary goal be to open up a new segment of M buyers? I tend to go with the latter.

I'm a great example of someone who might switch to AMG, but the value just isn't there: it's about 30% more on a lease, it's a soft top, it's a crappier transmission with a stalk shifter, it doesn't look as nice, and it isn't as sharp as the M4. But it does have v8. That's just not a great match up for me whether you add AWD or not. So who does it work for? People that like Benz and would probably never buy a BMW.
I switched over from an AMG to an M3.

The dynamic ability of the M3 and the quality of the interior won out in the end. Not to mention connected drive and coding which isn't available on the Benz.

I never thought I'd leave AMG but the F80 to me is near perfection both interior and exterior wise. And for me cost didn't play a role at all. The fact that the M3 was cheaper than the C63 was an unexpected bonus.

Anybody that has driven a C63 sedan would know there is just no comparison between handling and dynamism that an M car provides. The gearbox on the C63 has improved but it's no where near as good as our DCT or the ZF gearbox which will likely become the standard across the BMW range in the future.

My one major dissapointed with the M3 was the exhaust. The M performance exhaust upgrade has fixed that issue.

The much harder decision for me was between the Alfa quadrifuglio and the M3. In the end reliability concerns scared me off the Alfa. But it is one impressive beast.

Last edited by drgmt; 05-26-2017 at 08:46 AM..
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      05-26-2017, 08:18 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skid123 View Post
I thought the next^2 one is going to be at least a hybrid if not all electric...
FAKE NEWS!

Don't feel bad though - I thought the next one was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
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      05-26-2017, 08:25 AM   #50
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I am ok with Xdrive I will boost sales in the New England area.
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      05-26-2017, 08:37 AM   #51
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One Word if they do it will be a big plus for people who lives in a region with lots of rain and snow
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      05-26-2017, 12:47 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by Seniorleb View Post
One Word if they do it will be a big plus for people who lives in a region with lots of rain and snow
mkoesel keeps trying to convince us that the new market share profit won't justify the extra costs unless AMG does it.

He's probably right given the design lead times and costs, but intuitively I think BMW should go for it.
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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
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      05-26-2017, 05:44 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by GrussGott View Post
mkoesel keeps trying to convince us that the new market share profit won't justify the extra costs unless AMG does it.

He's probably right given the design lead times and costs, but intuitively I think BMW should go for it.
With less than 500hp (as I read on bimmerpost), better control system and better suspension settings, the Gxx M3 can surely do without M xDrive.
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      05-26-2017, 05:48 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
FAKE NEWS!

Don't feel bad though - I thought the next one was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
lol. It has been too quiet, we need fresh M3 rumors now the big brother is almost out!
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      06-01-2017, 07:24 AM   #55
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How do you guys feel about an AWD M3/M4?

How do you guys feel about an AWD next M3/M4 like the F90?
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      06-02-2017, 01:30 PM   #56
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just a few votes so far, but interesting - most people either want AWD or don't care. Maybe BMW has focus grouped this and found the same thing?
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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
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      06-02-2017, 02:37 PM   #57
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I don't see what the downside is. For those that like or need the AWD it's there. For traditionalists you never have to turn it on if you don't want to. For everyone else you can pick what you want at any given moment. Yeah it'll add some weight but they'll figure a way out to mitigate the weight gain in other areas. Seems like a win-win to me.
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      06-02-2017, 07:34 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sjuhawks19 View Post
I don't see what the downside is. For those that like or need the AWD it's there. For traditionalists you never have to turn it on if you don't want to. For everyone else you can pick what you want at any given moment. Yeah it'll add some weight but they'll figure a way out to mitigate the weight gain in other areas. Seems like a win-win to me.
It's rarely that simple in terms of keeping the preferred weight distribution and agility a RWD car provides when adding an AWD system. GTR, 911 for example pull of AWD flawlessly but most AWD cars are a detriment to performance.

What I would really love is a dynamic AWD system that turns itself on and off only when the rear tires slip. If the rear tires are not slipping I do not want the front tires powered at all (even if it's just 10% or very little), just like the GTR and 911 do.

It's cool that BMW offers manual control to turn the AWD system off but I prefer an automated system when its a RWD car 99% of the time, unless the rears lose traction.

I guess long winded way of saying I think BMW is dropping the ball with their implementation if I am understanding the system correctly.

Last edited by neilum; 06-02-2017 at 07:51 PM..
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      06-02-2017, 07:54 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by neilum View Post
It's rarely that simple in terms of keeping the preferred weight distribution and agility a RWD car provides when adding an AWD system. GTR, 911 for example pull of AWD flawlessly but most AWD cars are a detriment to performance.

What I would really love is a dynamic AWD system that turns itself on and off only when the rear tires slip. If the rear tires are not slipping I do not want the front tires powered at all, just like the GTR and 911 do.

It's cool that BMW offers manual control to turn the AWD system off but I prefer an automated system when its a RWD car 99% of the time, unless the rears lose traction.

I guess long winded way of saying I think BMW is dropping the ball with their implementation if I am understanding the system correctly.
That is a perspective sort of thing.

Some people prefer having the control of being able to turn it on and off, some others just leave it as it is and let the car take care of it.

BMW is not Porsche, nor should they try to copy what a Porsche car does.

Most common folk who buys the M (or AMG, Porsche etc) hardly care for these types of things. I doubt they would turn things on and off. As with most people who just have money, they want a car because of the badge first, performance 2nd. Us enthusiasts on the other hand care for performance first.
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      06-02-2017, 09:08 PM   #60
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How does turning off the AWD help? Weight is still there. Traction is worse? I feel like the big issue with AWD is the weight not the performance. If you had the option of same weight in a F80 but one with only rear wheels driving and the other with all 4 wheels driving what would you choose?
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      06-02-2017, 10:00 PM   #61
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There's a fundamental question that the M department needs to figure out. Are they going to keep going down the "more is better" rabbit hole? More tech, more power, more complexity, more dealer service, more weight, more money....and less ultimate driving machine. Do we really want what the M5 is becoming, 4500 pounds of tech bloat where we can all debate how bad iDrive 12.0 still is? Call me a purist, but I'll gladly take less of all that....and more of a real ultimate driving machine. What made these cars great once upon a time was their balance, handling characteristics, steering feedback, and power that didn't overcome all of the above. At some point I'm hoping BMW stops trying to build cars for a 0-60 magazine headline, and maybe goes against the trend and gets back to what made them such fun cars to begin with. Now someone get those damn kids off my lawn!
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      06-02-2017, 10:19 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by dailym3 View Post
There's a fundamental question that the M department needs to figure out. Are they going to keep going down the "more is better" rabbit hole? More tech, more power, more complexity, more dealer service, more weight, more money....and less ultimate driving machine. Do we really want what the M5 is becoming, 4500 pounds of tech bloat where we can all debate how bad iDrive 12.0 still is? Call me a purist, but I'll gladly take less of all that....and more of a real ultimate driving machine. What made these cars great once upon a time was their balance, handling characteristics, steering feedback, and power that didn't overcome all of the above. At some point I'm hoping BMW stops trying to build cars for a 0-60 magazine headline, and maybe goes against the trend and gets back to what made them such fun cars to begin with. Now someone get those damn kids off my lawn!
An M-car is a mass market performance car that is mostly a daily driver but can also be used for sport (i.e., track use). Each generation meets that mission with the latest technology, technical and mechanical, which means M cars get better and better at the dual duty as the years go by. And, the F8x generation is faster, more capable, and more comfortable - both duties - than every generation before it.

What an M-car is not, is a niche spec racer, and it never was. But good news! Now, for the first time, you can buy a spec racer M4, the GT4.

That's about as pure as it gets.
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      06-02-2017, 10:43 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by GrussGott View Post
An M-car is a mass market performance car that is mostly a daily driver but can also be used for sport (i.e., track use). Each generation meets that mission with the latest technology, technical and mechanical, which means M cars get better and better at the dual duty as the years go by. And, the F8x generation is faster, more capable, and more comfortable - both duties - than every generation before it.

What an M-car is not, is a niche spec racer, and it never was. But good news! Now, for the first time, you can buy a spec racer M4, the GT4.

That's about as pure as it gets.
Conceptually I understand where you are coming from, but at some point, maybe around the E46 time frame, the word better became blurred I think. There's a point where physical limits come into play. Like the limits of tires and public roadways and normal driver's capabilities. I'm not asking for a spec racer. I love the dual capability of an M car, I just don't need seat massagers, fragrance wafters, gesture controls, and all the nonsense that somehow BMW thinks we can't live without. I'll give them 50hp back for 500 pounds. And I'll give them their tech options for $10k. I'll still have a very comfortable street car that's more reliable, costs less, and is still more fun to drive. And no, I don't want the car to drive for me either
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      06-02-2017, 11:20 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by dailym3 View Post
Conceptually I understand where you are coming from, but at some point, maybe around the E46 time frame, the word better became blurred I think. There's a point where physical limits come into play. Like the limits of tires and public roadways and normal driver's capabilities. I'm not asking for a spec racer. I love the dual capability of an M car, I just don't need seat massagers, fragrance wafters, gesture controls, and all the nonsense that somehow BMW thinks we can't live without. I'll give them 50hp back for 500 pounds. And I'll give them their tech options for $10k. I'll still have a very comfortable street car that's more reliable, costs less, and is still more fun to drive. And no, I don't want the car to drive for me either
yeah, I hear ya, and given that, I'd say you don't want an M4, maybe the CS, cause the M4 is always going to be mass market ... which is why I think the next one is going to have M xDrive, but my theory is probably getting ahead of reality.

but you read it here first: the next M4 will have M xDrive.

Either that or it won't, but I'm POSITIVE it'll be one of the two.
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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.

Last edited by GrussGott; 06-02-2017 at 11:26 PM..
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      06-03-2017, 12:20 AM   #65
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For example, BMW has DCTs, AMG never has yet AMG sales have grown and BMW isn't pressured to follow suit (until now?)
It is interesting to note that the only true sports car in the amg line has a Getrag DCT.

if the next m3 is awd, im probably bailing.
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      06-03-2017, 03:02 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by GrussGott View Post
For example, BMW has DCTs, AMG never has yet AMG sales have grown and BMW isn't pressured to follow suit (until now?)
It is interesting to note that the only true sports car in the amg line has a Getrag DCT.

if the next m3 is awd, im probably bailing.
Maybe that's why Clarkson said F80 might become a good car years later on that other thread.
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