[IK6SPEED]

Originally Posted by Jason

At the same time, another development team is putting engines, transmissions and brakes through their paces. They are even given police protection for their runs up and down the 4,000-metre-high Mount Whitney. While law enforcement secures the test route at the top and bottom of the climb, the testers hustle the prototypes time and again up the snaking roads and back down – accelerating hard and braking suddenly to a standstill with crushing frequency.

So I spent 10 minutes looking at Mount Whitney on Google Maps.

Can anyone find a road for “runs up and down the 4000-metre-high Mount Whitney” that LEO has to secure?

Or more “creative imagination” from BMW’s Marketing Department?

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by rjd598

for sure, chris harris.

Typical Zyzz.

[GOLFFRR]

here we are again!! looking forward to the new design

[otay]

Wow, that's some serious marketing build up. This thing better kick ass!

- Maybe it will grow on me, but still not liking the front end, which is very much like G30.
- Round tail pipes for everything but M340i, right? And trapezoidal for M340i?

[paliknight]

There's no way they tested their previous BMW models like this.

[jackaleyess]

I may purchase LCI should my Q50 ages.

[nozydog]

I really don't think they'd be testing it in a wind tunnel with all that camo on!!!

[Nahlem]

They should test this during winter time in the Midwest-east Sweden where the salt on the roads and the constant shift in temperatures from +5-8c during days to -10-15c during nights takes it's toll on the cars harder then Northern Sweden where salt is forbidden to use due to certain conditions now allowing salt usage there. If we had snow like this constantly on the roads the wear and tear would be minimal on the car so this type of test isn't quite fair.

If we are testing for real winter conditions.

Biggest issues for cars in Midwest Sweden

-Salt
-Stone Chips
-Constant Shift in temperatures
-Hard availability for washing the cars during winter.
-Metal Chips from cars with spiked tires.

Just a few of the horrific road conditions hitting the midwest-mideast of Sweden.

The Pictures below is my winter car, cause driving any regular BMW here would cause so much damage especially under the car where you can't reach to wash and the salt just keeps collecting causing corrosion damage on vital bearing parts of the car.

[farns2345]

So much build up. Just reveal it already

[Kingpin4]

+1

[uniqueMR]

Bring it on, New 3

[b2nvs2001]

Wow - bigger, fatter and less bmw than ever with no MT.

I'm betting it'll still be a lot more drivable than the competition but as far as being an ultimate driving machine - I doubt these cars qualify any further.

[dopefishz]

Originally Posted by b2nvs2001

Wow - bigger, fatter and less bmw than ever with no MT.

I'm betting it'll still be a lot more drivable than the competition but as far as being an ultimate driving machine - I doubt these cars qualify any further.

+1

[cfm56d7b]

Very interested in learning more about suspension changes.

[JRobUSC]

Originally Posted by b2nvs2001

Wow - bigger, fatter and less bmw than ever with no MT.

I'm betting it'll still be a lot more drivable than the competition but as far as being an ultimate driving machine - I doubt these cars qualify any further.

It’ll be lighter, more powerful, faster, and better handling than the current 3-series and all the competitors. The E46 330xi only weighs about 100lbs less than a 2018 330xi, which means the G20 and E46 will be about the same weight. So the only thing “worse” for the G20 vs the much beloved E46 will be the lack of a stick. If everything else is better, one thing is the same, and it isn’t a stick, does that disqualify it as a BMW?

[otay]

Originally Posted by JRobUSC

It’ll be lighter, more powerful, faster, and better handling than the current 3-series and all the competitors. The E46 330xi only weighs about 100lbs less than a 2018 330xi, which means the G20 and E46 will be about the same weight. So the only thing “worse” for the G20 vs the much beloved E46 will be the lack of a stick. If everything else is better, one thing is the same, and it isn’t a stick, does that disqualify it as a BMW?

+1

[b2nvs2001]

Originally Posted by JRobUSC

It'll be lighter, more powerful, faster, and better handling than the current 3-series and all the competitors. The E46 330xi only weighs about 100lbs less than a 2018 330xi, which means the G20 and E46 will be about the same weight. So the only thing "worse" for the G20 vs the much beloved E46 will be the lack of a stick. If everything else is better, one thing is the same, and it isn't a stick, does that disqualify it as a BMW?

Just my opinion - we can agree to disagree.

First- the lack of MT is massive. Let's not underplay this. Driving a MT injects far more experience to driving. I'm hoping none of us disagree with this.

Second - lighter is great. But then when you have a car that is basically becoming if not already is the size of previous generations of 5 series or E class, things become a little more ropey - please ask any autocross or track driver. Indeed when I personally saw the g20 testing around the Nurburgring last March I actually did think it was a 5 series due to size until I was corrected.

Third - Along with the other changes to the G20 is the horrendous current version of the electric steering. Precise it may be but steering feel? Holy hell - its a disgrace. I can only hope it will be tons better with the new version like porches already have. But this is just hope and not fact. However, noting BMWs current practice of cost saving and cost cutting (maintenance plan cuts to name but one example) and their ever increasing need to please shareholders rather than us mere fraction of car enthusiasts, it is more likely that they stay status quo.

Fourth - does this mean this car will be a worse road car? Again my conjecture but probably not - for the majority of daily car drivers this will be smoother, more luxurious and have more infotainment features. The reason for my hypothesis is the way Audi has been eating into bmw's market share recently. Only an inept businessman would not compare to the competition and not try to copy what works. More evidence for this is the trend seen with very many recently released BMW vehicles.

And what do Audi do? They make the car more luxurious, smoother and have more infotainment features. But do they bother to fix that horrible engine front overhang that continues to relentlessly produce understeer? No - of course not - why would they!

But if BMW follows this pattern now - that wouldn't be making our cars more BMW like - would they...

Just my humble opinion after owning 8 bmws in my lifetime and currently a 2011.75 E90 <10k mile M3 competition with MT. Again, we can agree to disagree

[nozydog]

Nothing at all wrong with my 2017 F30 so if this is better, which it will be, then all is well...

[b2nvs2001]

Originally Posted by nozydog

Nothing at all wrong with my 2017 F30 so if this is better, which it will be, then all is well...

Just to clarify so there's no misunderstanding.

The F30 is a great car. My wife and I love it as a daily driver.

Maybe I'm being nostalgic but is it better the E30 325i, E36 328i m-sport, E46 M3 and E90 M3 that I, to this day, truly love and remember, all for different reasons? To me, it isn't - it's a yawn - forgettable. I also put my money where my mouth is and continue to keep my 7 year old "ancient" E90 after test driving the latest M3 with MT.

But that's a story for another time...

Anyway - I'm sure I've bored the lot of you so I'll keep quiet from now.

[OriginalFake]

Originally Posted by JRobUSC

It’ll be lighter, more powerful, faster, and better handling than the current 3-series and all the competitors. The E46 330xi only weighs about 100lbs less than a 2018 330xi, which means the G20 and E46 will be about the same weight. So the only thing “worse” for the G20 vs the much beloved E46 will be the lack of a stick. If everything else is better, one thing is the same, and it isn’t a stick, does that disqualify it as a BMW?

Yeah I'm with you. I love that people take the Ultimate Driving Machine thing to heart. It was always a marketing phrase and just because a car is bigger than the predecessor or doesn't have a manual, that doesn't make it any less of a BMW. Everyone holds the E46 so highly but didn't they have an auto version of that car? Does that mean the auto version wasn't the "Ultimate Driving Machine"?

[upsidedownfunnel]

Originally Posted by b2nvs2001

Just my opinion - we can agree to disagree.

First- the lack of MT is massive. Let's not underplay this. Driving a MT injects far more experience to driving. I'm hoping none of us disagree with this.

Second - lighter is great. But then when you have a car that is basically becoming if not already is the size of previous generations of 5 series or E class, things become a little more ropey - please ask any autocross or track driver. Indeed when I personally saw the g20 testing around the Nurburgring last March I actually did think it was a 5 series due to size until I was corrected.

Third - Along with the other changes to the G20 is the horrendous current version of the electric steering. Precise it may be but steering feel? Holy hell - its a disgrace. I can only hope it will be tons better with the new version like porches already have. But this is just hope and not fact. However, noting BMWs current practice of cost saving and cost cutting (maintenance plan cuts to name but one example) and their ever increasing need to please shareholders rather than us mere fraction of car enthusiasts, it is more likely that they stay status quo.

Fourth - does this mean this car will be a worse road car? Again my conjecture but probably not - for the majority of daily car drivers this will be smoother, more luxurious and have more infotainment features. The reason for my hypothesis is the way Audi has been eating into bmw's market share recently. Only an inept businessman would not compare to the competition and not try to copy what works. More evidence for this is the trend seen with very many recently released BMW vehicles.

And what do Audi do? They make the car more luxurious, smoother and have more infotainment features. But do they bother to fix that horrible engine front overhang that continues to relentlessly produce understeer? No - of course not - why would they!

But if BMW follows this pattern now - that wouldn't be making our cars more BMW like - would they...

Just my humble opinion after owning 8 bmws in my lifetime and currently a 2011.75 E90 <10k mile M3 competition with MT. Again, we can agree to disagree

Completely agree with you about the lack of manual. It's sickening to think that BMW is releasing a much more capable car in the G20 and then axing the manual. Hate it.

However, the E90 was the heaviest 3 series ever and it will stay that way for a while. The F30 was lighter and the G20 is even lighter still. The last 5 series that was even close to the G20 in size was the American E28 from 81-88. All subsequent ones were longer than the F30. I'm not saying I don't like small cars, but cars are so much safer these days. For my daily driver, I want something safe and fun.

Also, you fell weight, not size. Having an extra inch or two in the back of your car CAN'T be felt if the car weighs the same or less. Having a bumper that sticks out an extra inch in the front can't be felt. If you like your E90 so much, there's no reason you couldn't have as much fun in a car slightly larger yet much lighter. Of course, the F30 had terrible suspension tuning and steering compared to the E90, but that's another conversation.

[upsidedownfunnel]

Originally Posted by paliknight

There's no way they tested their previous BMW models like this.

All major cars are tested like this. Especially cars made to run well in many different environments.