[M2Cmtl]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Some sound like meltdowns. You could label some people passionate, but many are just complainers who are resistant to change.


Usually if you don't like a restaurant's food, you just stop eating there. If you don't like the way a manufacturer designs their shoes, you simply buy another brand. It should be the same with cars/bikes.

I agree but when you are passionate about cars you get invested into a brand... but yeah just buy something else! Or heck, just buy a used F80...

[Poiseuille]

Originally Posted by Giom

Interesting how those of us that actually like this design are downright vilified and insulted over our taste.

Not cool, these days, to be a minority within the BMW group...

.

[Audio Fan]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Some sound like meltdowns. You could label some people passionate, but many are just complainers who are resistant to change.


Usually if you don't like a restaurant's food, you just stop eating there. If you don't like the way a manufacturer designs their shoes, you simply buy another brand. It should be the same with cars/bikes.

Having a couple of small children, it definitely seems like meltdowns and tantrums in a Twitter-like way by some. I've went from surprised to entertained by the reactions. The thing that I keep thinking is that the basic (non-M) 3/4 series coupes have never been cars that wow the masses from a looks or performance perspective. They've always been very conservative, decent looking cars that performed decently - just BMW enough to avoid being boring, but not much more. When you go through the various threads on the 4, you'd think Porsche is changing the 911 to look like a Challenger.

There is so much competition out there these days, I'm guessing BMW is trying to differentiate itself and provide a more sexy car in a relatively low volume segment. They can't just evolve a bit and compete with MB, Alpha, and Audi products, which look darn good (and have big grills) in there base forms. This is the result of real, serious competition. If they don't shake things up, they get their lunch eaten. However, with all design, the more wow you try to bring, the more you risk alienating some while exciting others. BMW might miss the mark, hit a home run, or be average. We won't know for awhile, but we do know that this is the age for rage (for everything).

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Audio Fan

Having a couple of small children, it definitely seems like meltdowns and tantrums in a Twitter-like way by some. I've went from surprised to entertained by the reactions. The thing that I keep thinking is that the basic (non-M) 3/4 series coupes have never been cars that wow the masses from a looks or performance perspective. They've always been very conservative, decent looking cars that performed decently - just BMW enough to avoid being boring, but not much more. When you go through the various threads on the 4, you'd think Porsche is changing the 911 to look like a Challenger.

There is so much competition out there these days, I'm guessing BMW is trying to differentiate itself and provide a more sexy car in a relatively low volume segment. They can't just evolve a bit and compete with MB, Alpha, and Audi products, which look darn good (and have big grills) in there base forms. This is the result of real, serious competition. If they don't shake things up, they get there lunch eaten. However, with all design, the more wow you try to bring, the more you risk alienating some while exciting others. BMW might miss the mark, hit a home run, or be average. We won't know for awhile, but we do know that this is the age for rage (for everything).

Well said my friend.

[eman4517]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Some sound like meltdowns. You could label some people passionate, but many are just complainers who are resistant to change.


Usually if you don't like a restaurant's food, you just stop eating there. If you don't like the way a manufacturer designs their shoes, you simply buy another brand. It should be the same with cars/bikes.

Yes, agreed in a perfect pre-social media world that would definitely happen.

But in today's climate, social media can be brutal. It can either help make or break any product's success (or if consistently bad, ruin an entire brand) and if consumers don't like something, trust me, you will know it, and companies know this and it helps them to improve.

The strategy of many premium brands to earn your hard-earned $ with a premium product and hook you, then adopt small incremental profit margin improvements (cost effective substitutions) over time to increase their profit margin.

They will do this "watering down" to the point that consumers start to notice a drop in perceived quality and when consumers do, trust me, you will hear it on the net.. Hence the importance to Like us on Google, Facebook, Yelp, Dealer rater, Open Table, give us 5 stars ,etc etc.

Deeper dive: complaints are also a culturally weighted; certain cultures and/or demographics have higher expectations and complain more and others are more tolerant and complain less.

So, although you may not complain if you had a sh*tty meal at your favorite restaurant, the guy next to you might have what you call a meltdown and complain about his experience on the net, then not go back to that establishment until the good reviews return. It's all relative and subjective I guess.

Plus whats going on in the world now doesn't help. People have shorter fuses and tolerance levels.

[Teutonic]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Some sound like meltdowns. You could label some people passionate, but many are just complainers who are resistant to change.

Usually if you don't like a restaurant's food, you just stop eating there. If you don't like the way a manufacturer designs their shoes, you simply buy another brand. It should be the same with cars/bikes.

Not resistant to change; just resistant to UGLY. Big difference.
Might drive like cloud 9, if it looks like that, I am not driving one.
Yes, LOOKS DOES MATTER BIG TIME to me. Actually, a lot!

As for the rest, I am already on the waiting list for the new RS6.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Teutonic

Not resistant to change; just resistant to UGLY. Big difference.
Might drive like cloud 9, if it looks like that, I am not driving one.
Yes, LOOKS DOES MATTER BIG TIME to me. Actually, a lot!

As for the rest, I am already on the waiting list for the new RS6.

The RS6 is nice.

[Straitkash]

I felt like I got molested when I see those photos.

[Tallest]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Top seller?!? Interesting. I didn't see any X3's or X5's in this thread. The 4 Series is like #5 or #6 on the list.

In the US you are correct, but I was referring to BMW as global company, and talking in global context about design (because there is no USA specific 3 series design). Hence my comment is accurate, for global volumes 3-4 series is probably easily outselling X3 or X5 and if something changed in last couple of years, then still no way 3-4 series is at position five or six globally. Those stats are also boosted by the fact that there is no new 4 series for 7 years, and there is brand nex X3 and X5 that came out recently (to the dismay of previous gen owners in X5s case who have this nice depreciation to contend with).

[Giom]

Originally Posted by Straitkash

I felt like I got molested when I see those photos.

Your Honor, I rest my case.

[lancerr]

Originally Posted by Audio Fan

Having a couple of small children, it definitely seems like meltdowns and tantrums in a Twitter-like way by some. I've went from surprised to entertained by the reactions. The thing that I keep thinking is that the basic (non-M) 3/4 series coupes have never been cars that wow the masses from a looks or performance perspective. They've always been very conservative, decent looking cars that performed decently - just BMW enough to avoid being boring, but not much more. When you go through the various threads on the 4, you'd think Porsche is changing the 911 to look like a Challenger.

There is so much competition out there these days, I'm guessing BMW is trying to differentiate itself and provide a more sexy car in a relatively low volume segment. They can't just evolve a bit and compete with MB, Alpha, and Audi products, which look darn good (and have big grills) in there base forms. This is the result of real, serious competition. If they don't shake things up, they get their lunch eaten. However, with all design, the more wow you try to bring, the more you risk alienating some while exciting others. BMW might miss the mark, hit a home run, or be average. We won't know for awhile, but we do know that this is the age for rage (for everything).

You are on a bmw forum. Thats already a self selected group of enthusiasts and enthusiasts have options. thats what makes it fun. Enthusiasts will loudly complain as a means of venting frustration at seeing their brand being "diluted" but only a few will leave.

None of the comments have seemed like meltdowns. If you are reading it in that voice in your head, that says more about you.

[eman4517]

Originally Posted by Tallest

In the US you are correct, but I was referring to BMW as global company, and talking in global context about design (because there is no USA specific 3 series design). Hence my comment is accurate, for global volumes 3-4 series is probably easily outselling X3 or X5 and if something changed in last couple of years, then still no way 3-4 series is at position five or six globally. Those stats are also boosted by the fact that there is no new 4 series for 7 years, and there is brand nex X3 and X5 that came out recently (to the dismay of previous gen owners in X5s case who have this nice depreciation to contend with).

Especially if you factor in the excessive sales numbers "punching" or padding that BMW has been doing recently in the U.S. to falsely inflate their value.

Edit) They did that with my '18 X1. It was new but found I lost 9 months warranty because it was reported sold and delivered. It only had 35 miles on it. I made them certify it to give me a warranty extension.

I could be wrong but I think they're still under SEC investigation for this, so numbers aren't that reliable..

[Audio Fan]

Originally Posted by lancerr

You are on a bmw forum. Thats already a self selected group of enthusiasts and enthusiasts have options. thats what makes it fun. Enthusiasts will loudly complain as a means of venting frustration at seeing their brand being "diluted" but only a few will leave.

None of the comments have seemed like meltdowns. If you are reading it in that voice in your head, that says more about you.

Or, you might not have been reading all the threads as much as I have.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Audio Fan

Or, you might not have been reading all the threads as much as I have.

It's exactly that.

[solstice]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

It's exactly that.

That and if you are melting down yourself it’s harder to spot

[TodmordenLad]

Originally Posted by Crusader

A face only a mother could love.

From a distance.... whilst wearing sunglasses

[RinconHeat]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Some sound like meltdowns. You could label some people passionate, but many are just complainers who are resistant to change.


Usually if you don't like a restaurant's food, you just stop eating there. If you don't like the way a manufacturer designs their shoes, you simply buy another brand. It should be the same with cars/bikes.

Many businesses pay top dollar for the kind of feedback we give BMW on the daily (not that they are acting on it it seems). No one likes to hear disagreement on matters of aesthetics as it is personal and emotional. The emotionality IS the point. We should expect feelings to be expressed- if there wasn't an intuitive, non-rational component to cars we would all be driving Prius(s).

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by RinconHeat

Many businesses pay top dollar for the kind of feedback we give BMW on the daily (not that they are acting on it it seems). No one likes to hear disagreement on matters of aesthetics as it is personal and emotional. The emotionality IS the point. We should expect feelings to be expressed- if there wasn't an intuitive, non-rational component to cars we would all be driving Prius(s).

It's the constant, relentless nature of it that resembles a meltdown.

[t5pilot]

Originally Posted by antzcrashing

The blue is a good look for this car

A heavy collision would be a better look. The colour is nice. The car, quite frankly, is awful.
I reckon we'll see a very early LCI, motivated primarily by lack of sales, in what is probably the company's biggest market share presently.

[antzcrashing]

Originally Posted by t5pilot

A heavy collision would be a better look. The colour is nice. The car, quite frankly, is awful.
I reckon we'll see a very early LCI, motivated primarily by lack of sales, in what is probably the company's biggest market share presently.

Isnt the 3 series much higher market share than the 4? Anyone know the numbers?

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by antzcrashing

Isnt the 3 series much higher market share than the 4? Anyone know the numbers?

It is. It outsells the coupe.

[VetteGuy]

The 3er far outsells the 4er here in the U.S., and dramatically so during the COVID beaten 2nd quarter of 2020. About 3:1 in the 2nd quarter of 2019 and 4:1 in the same quarter this year. The new G22 will stand on its own and decisions about LCI will most likely he made on comparisons of its sales against sales of the previous models, or is impact against Audi and MB coupes.