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      06-23-2020, 07:41 AM   #1
Sootchucker
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Newbie G20 Questions

Hi all, newbie here. Currently driving a 2018 MK7.5 GTI and have owned exclusively Volkswagen's for the last 20 years. Iím now thinking it might be time for a change. To be honest Iíve never really looked at BMWís, but I have to say to really liking the new 2020 G20 3 series model.

So, as I have zero experience of BMW, I do have a number of questions please (apologies in advanced if there are too many). The model Iím looking at is the UK spec 320i (petrol) M-Sport or M-Sport Plus models (with a few options). Some of the questions might seem very obvious to seasoned BMW owners, but like I say, the brand would be entirely new to me.

So to the questions:

Can anyone tell me why on the new 2020 price list, the ďstandardĒ 320i M-Sport lists at £36,200, and the 320i M-Sport Plus Edition at £41,025 (a difference of £4,825), and yet in the options list, it list the M-Sport Plus package (code ZMS) at ďonlyĒ £2,950 as an add on package to the M-Sport ?

Generally speaking, whatís the reliability like on BMW petrol modes. Whilst VW certainly isnít at the top of the list in this regards, I have to say in the last 20 years and 7 cars, the list of issues or failures I can count on the fingers of one hand, and the last 3 MK7 Golfís (touch wood), have all been faultlessly reliable.

I really like the Metallic Portimao Blue1, but as I understand it this colour isnít available on M-Sport Plus models? Is there a blue in the Sport-Plus thatís similar?

As Iíll no doubt be going for 19Ē alloys (as thatís what my Golf has), I was considering the adaptive suspension but this only appears to be part of the M-Sport Plus package (i.e. not available separately) is that correct ?

Does the car have SD card slots for music or is it all now streamed by connected apps (I currently have most of my music on a 128GB SD card). Also, whilst we are talking about apps, Iíve heard that Spotify and Apple Carplay arenít there as standard and have to be ďdownloadedĒ is that correct, and that BMW charges annually for Apple Carplay ?

Also, connected to the above, Iíve heard that BMW has never supported Android Auto (which is what I use all the time in the Golf as my phone is a Samsung Galaxy). I hear rumours that this is coming (finally) to BMW, but is this actually true and therefore does anyone know if it will be a ďfreeĒ upgrade when it arrives (letís not get into a discussion on Carplay vs Android Auto).

I donít do much night-time driving on rural and country lanes so will not be specing the BMW laser light option (no matter how good they are), but are the standard adaptive headlights still good enough. My Golf has the adaptive LED lighting package, so not only bends around corners but can track cars ahead and mask off part of the main beam so as not to dazzle oncoming drivers whilst still maintaining main beam all the time. To be honest, Iíve used this feature twice since Iíve had the car in 2 years.

My Golf has active traffic sign recognition (i.e. a camera on the windscreen reads road signs and then active displays then on the digital dash). Does the M-Sport come with that feature as standard or are they just static signs and read off the cars Navigation data rather than via a camera ?

Sorry to keep referring back to my Golf, but thatís my only point of reference. This also has the upgraded ďDynaudioĒ hifi with a sub-woofer in the spare wheel. As Iím trying to keep the configuration costs reasonable, Iíve current not specified the optional Harman Kardon system for £820, so my question is what does the ďstandardĒ stereo sound like please ?

Think thatís all for now, and once again apologies for so many questions from a newbie, but you would be a big help if I could get opinions on a few of them at least ?

Last edited by Sootchucker; 06-23-2020 at 07:56 AM..
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      06-23-2020, 09:10 AM   #2
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Well across to the Darkside....!

I've had my 330e for just under 2 weeks so will probably be the least amount of help but a few things I can perhaps help with.

I'm pretty sure you can Portimao Blue and add the M Sport Pro package which is £2200 on the Configurator which takes it to £39,395? Can't seem to see a 320i M Sport+ as a choice.

Adaptive definitely only available as part as that package though but it seems good value for £2200. BMW has gone towards packages rather than having tons of individual options to choose from. Guess its easier for WTLP.

Having seen any SD slots yet. Apple Carplay (including wireless) is standard on a M Sport and you get subscriptions to music streaming. Standard hifi seems decent, better than the standard one in the GTI.

There's a thread about the LEDs and generally, people seem happy. I though high beam didn't appear as bright as it doesn't use a separate bulb like the Golf but haven't done much night driving yet.

Traffic signs are picked up instantly and displayed really clearly.

As I said, early days for me but a very different car to the GTI. Obviously mine has very beneficial tax implications as a company car but I'm really enjoying it and its a very nice place to sit.
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      06-23-2020, 09:20 AM   #3
Sootchucker
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Thanks Jim, it does help. One further question then, if the high beam just uses the outer dipped beam units, where function do the inner lights serve ?
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      06-23-2020, 09:29 AM   #4
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My last car was a VW Tiguan with most of the options you have on your Golf. I now have a G20 M Sport Plus, so I can make most of the comparisons for you.

I would say the standard BMW sound is not quite as good as the Dynaudio (as you would expect), but I find it good enough. I’ve never heard the HK sound so I can’t offer an opinion on that.

TSR is better on the BMW, much faster.

Adaptive lights on the BMW are just the ones that light up corners - no high beam assist like you have now. I do miss this, but I expect to get used to having to dip the beam manually again (my last 4 VAG cars all had HBA).

Wireless (free) Apple Carplay works well. I use that for my Spotify so I can’t comment about the built in version. No SD or CD slots for playing music.
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      06-23-2020, 10:07 AM   #5
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If you've got Dynaudio in your golf, you really need to spec the HK. The Dynaudio systems are very good, so moving to a standard BMW system you'll wish you had upgraded - the standard fit audio systems in BMWs are pitiful if you like your music.
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      06-23-2020, 11:38 AM   #6
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I think the difference in price of the M Sport Plus Edition over the M Sport Plus Pack added to a standard MSport is because the Plus Edition gives you the choice of the three Individual Colours over the standard range of five colours.

So if you're happy with the standard colour range, just add the MSport Plus Pack to the MSport model, the only difference will be the colour you choose, everything else will be the same as far as I'm aware. You also get more interior options regarding trim with the MSport Plus Pack.
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      06-23-2020, 11:41 AM   #7
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I've recently moved from a mk7.5 GTD into a 320i M Sport. I do 50,000 miles a year so got to know the golf well over 3yrs.

The M Sport plus model gives you different paint options, black wheels, black mirrors and different interior choices. All of these are not available on regular M Sport variants. It also adds the M Sport plus pack which you can spec as an approx £2k option on std M Sport models. This includes HK audio, brakes, black grill and tailpipes plus the striped seat belts.

For me, the only reason to choose m sport plus model is if you have a desire for one of the unique paint colours. Even then, it's an expensive option.


If you like music, HK is a must. The std adaptive lights are very good (maybe slightly better than the golf).

Spend some time on the configurator and prepare to lose a few hours of your life on here searching. It really helped me when I was preparing to order.

Finally, the 320i is particularly detuned from factory. It's very easy to extract 280-300bhp with a few choice modifications 👍
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      06-23-2020, 01:08 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Don76 View Post
I've recently moved from a mk7.5 GTD into a 320i M Sport. I do 50,000 miles a year so got to know the golf well over 3yrs.

The M Sport plus model gives you different paint options, black wheels, black mirrors and different interior choices. All of these are not available on regular M Sport variants. It also adds the M Sport plus pack which you can spec as an approx £2k option on std M Sport models. This includes HK audio, brakes, black grill and tailpipes plus the striped seat belts.

For me, the only reason to choose m sport plus model is if you have a desire for one of the unique paint colours. Even then, it's an expensive option.


If you like music, HK is a must. The std adaptive lights are very good (maybe slightly better than the golf).

Spend some time on the configurator and prepare to lose a few hours of your life on here searching. It really helped me when I was preparing to order.

Finally, the 320i is particularly detuned from factory. It's very easy to extract 280-300bhp with a few choice modifications 👍
M-sport Plus Pack doesn't give you HK - it used to but not any more. I've literally just ordered mine, and the dealer said the same thing (my face lit up thinking I was saving £820), but you need to spec HK separately unfortunately!

I've got HK in my 5 series and it is well worth the money - spend some time setting the equaliser up right and it's really good.
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      06-23-2020, 02:23 PM   #9
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The standard audio is poor imo, but i do like my audio. £820 for the HK is a no brainer, unless you are ordering a 330/340 then im not sure the plus is worth it, i'd refer to spend it on options to make the car nicer.

The tech pack is a good bet, i would have liked it, but i wear polarised sunnies, which dont work with the HUD.

The 360 cameras are also a nice touch, im addicted to keyless entry, so i added the comfort pack aswell.

Portimao blue and Sunset orange are nice, but Dravit grey on the plus is stunning on a sunny day. The interior options are good aswell.
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      06-23-2020, 05:32 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wassap View Post
The standard audio is poor imo, but i do like my audio. £820 for the HK is a no brainer, unless you are ordering a 330/340 then im not sure the plus is worth it, i'd refer to spend it on options to make the car nicer.

The tech pack is a good bet, i would have liked it, but i wear polarised sunnies, which dont work with the HUD.

The 360 cameras are also a nice touch, im addicted to keyless entry, so i added the comfort pack aswell.

Portimao blue and Sunset orange are nice, but Dravit grey on the plus is stunning on a sunny day. The interior options are good aswell.
I also wear polarised sunnies and have the HUD and surprisingly they are ok.
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      06-23-2020, 06:00 PM   #11
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Hi there.

HK system is definitely worth the upgrade. Basic system is poor and HK makes the cabin look better with the tweeters in the door.

No SD card slot. All the USBs apart from 1 are USB C. All remote apps but you can download music onto the hard drive.

Apple CarPlay is standard and is now a one off cost for life. Android Auto is coming this July and that's confirmed. Will be free for life. They will issue an update over the air I understand.

HUD is great and the tech pack is worth having. This car is tech heavy so it's a good option.

Road sign recognition is both live I.e. reads the signs via the camera and built into the Nav. Part of live cockpit which I think is standard.

Parking assistant plus is also worth a look. It gives you the external cameras for 3D and 360 view. I use it a lot.

Laser lights are good but for me only worth it if doing a lot of driving in the dark on back roads. I tested both Lasers and adaptive LEDs and it's the only option and package I didn't tick on my M340i. The adaptive are great, move with steering around corners etc. The only niggle is that high beam assist only comes with laser lights. Why this is who knows. But I believe BMW are sorting this as the 1 series for cars built from September 2020 (I think) has a spare button for it and you can download HBA as an option that programs that button. I'm sure they will offer this in the 3 at some point. It's such a weird thing not to have standard.

If I was ordering a 320i, then tech pack and premium pack would be ticked. I prefer electric seats is the reason.

If I didn't want the premium pack then m sport pro pack would be hard to turn down. The M brakes and adaptive suspension are very very good. Only part of the M sport pro pack. Standard on M340i

Basically whatever you do the G20 is a really good car all round. I've had 4 previous BMWs and can count the issues on one hand. All minor.
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      06-24-2020, 02:17 AM   #12
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OK then slightly different question please. Whilst I’m going to look at a G20 this weekend, for my wanted spec, the car is listing at around £44k.

Looking at how much 6 month old cars and demonstrators are for sale for (some up to 25% off list), as a private buyer, depreciation does bother me. So it would have to be a cracking deal to get me into one. So what sort of discounts off list should I typically be looking at for a factory build, and assuming I’d then take BMW finance (at least for a few months)?
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      06-24-2020, 04:13 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sootchucker View Post
OK then slightly different question please. Whilst Iím going to look at a G20 this weekend, for my wanted spec, the car is listing at around £44k.

Looking at how much 6 month old cars and demonstrators are for sale for (some up to 25% off list), as a private buyer, depreciation does bother me. So it would have to be a cracking deal to get me into one. So what sort of discounts off list should I typically be looking at for a factory build, and assuming Iíd then take BMW finance (at least for a few months)?
When I was looking before just before Xmas the best deal I could find in the South of England was 18% off list. No idea what the market is like now.

As it happens, I went down the route you mentioned when an almost new 330i was put in front of me by the dealer I was half way through a new order with. Five months old with less than 3000 miles and every option except a tow bar! That was well over £20k below list for the exact same car new. The car was being used by the MD so it's worth checking out if there is anything in a dealers,fleet that they are not advertising for sale.

Only downside is whether it a,colour combination you like - I wouldn't have chosen black on black if ordering but perfectly happy at that price,saving.

The black does look amazing for at least five minutes after it has been cleaned though.....never again!!
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      06-24-2020, 05:39 AM   #14
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If you're ordering new now, it's always worth saying "if you can chuck in HK for free I'll do the deal" You'd be amazed what you can get reduced or at no cost if you just ask.
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      06-24-2020, 05:46 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sootchucker View Post
OK then slightly different question please. Whilst I'm going to look at a G20 this weekend, for my wanted spec, the car is listing at around £44k.

Looking at how much 6 month old cars and demonstrators are for sale for (some up to 25% off list), as a private buyer, depreciation does bother me. So it would have to be a cracking deal to get me into one. So what sort of discounts off list should I typically be looking at for a factory build, and assuming I'd then take BMW finance (at least for a few months)?
If you're a cash buyer, then looking on the second hand market is definitely the way to go (assuming you don't mind getting a car that isn't 100% to your spec), but if you're looking to PCP then definitely new. Current PCP rate on a new 3 is 4.9%, used is 10.9%. You couple that with a discount from list price - I've got over 15% discount with some other bits from the dealer chucked into the deal, you'll be much better off.

What you'll generally find is when attractive PCP rates are offered (BMW go as low as 1.9% I've seen) you'll just be sacrificing discount, I.e. they won't discount the car to the same level at the front end when offering a better PCP rate. Just be sure to look into the detail. Discount from list & total amount payable are the most important measures.
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      06-24-2020, 07:34 AM   #16
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If I were a cash buyer then I'd defo be going down the nearly new road. Check out the used car locator on bmw uk site.

There's pre reg cars on there with less than 50miles and big big savings
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      06-24-2020, 08:50 AM   #17
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If you're not bothered about it being brand new, seek out Paul Glynn at Williams Stockport. I bought my first from him, 10 month old, 3500 miles and £17k below list and I told him what I was prepared to pay. Think it was up at £530 per month on P.C.P. and I ended up with the same deposit and just under £400 p/m, nobody needs to pay 10.9% APR. And I P/Ex'd a shabby 1 series too. Unfortunately it was robbed within 12 hrs of me getting it and Paul managed to source me an exact same spec car, bar the colour, before it went online on the same deal. I looked for 3 weeks on AUC for a car in the only 2 colours I wanted and exact spec, to no avail. They get access to the lists of cars before they go live. So if you know what you want and what you're prepared to pay, it's always an option.
Let a good salesman do the leg work for you as I tried others and if the car wasn't in stock they wasn't interested
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      06-24-2020, 09:23 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith_C View Post
If you're not bothered about it being brand new, seek out Paul Glynn at Williams Stockport. I bought my first from him, 10 month old, 3500 miles and £17k below list and I told him what I was prepared to pay. Think it was up at £530 per month on P.C.P. and I ended up with the same deposit and just under £400 p/m, nobody needs to pay 10.9% APR. And I P/Ex'd a shabby 1 series too. Unfortunately it was robbed within 12 hrs of me getting it and Paul managed to source me an exact same spec car, bar the colour, before it went online on the same deal. I looked for 3 weeks on AUC for a car in the only 2 colours I wanted and exact spec, to no avail. They get access to the lists of cars before they go live. So if you know what you want and what you're prepared to pay, it's always an option.
Let a good salesman do the leg work for you as I tried others and if the car wasn't in stock they wasn't interested

How was it stolen, if you don't mind my asking?
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      06-24-2020, 09:30 AM   #19
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I managed 19% off list on a new M340i recently (build slot end of July). most where going to about 18%.

PCP is standard 4.9%, with fixed guaranteed future value so no negotiation is possible on the PCP deal...
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      06-24-2020, 02:16 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy-1878 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith_C View Post
If you're not bothered about it being brand new, seek out Paul Glynn at Williams Stockport. I bought my first from him, 10 month old, 3500 miles and £17k below list and I told him what I was prepared to pay. Think it was up at £530 per month on P.C.P. and I ended up with the same deposit and just under £400 p/m, nobody needs to pay 10.9% APR. And I P/Ex'd a shabby 1 series too. Unfortunately it was robbed within 12 hrs of me getting it and Paul managed to source me an exact same spec car, bar the colour, before it went online on the same deal. I looked for 3 weeks on AUC for a car in the only 2 colours I wanted and exact spec, to no avail. They get access to the lists of cars before they go live. So if you know what you want and what you're prepared to pay, it's always an option.
Let a good salesman do the leg work for you as I tried others and if the car wasn't in stock they wasn't interested

How was it stolen, if you don't mind my asking?
They smashed my patio door lock and took the keys. First thing I did when I picked the next one up was get a Autowatch Ghost fitted before I got it home.
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      06-24-2020, 04:07 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith_C View Post
If you're not bothered about it being brand new, seek out Paul Glynn at Williams Stockport. I bought my first from him, 10 month old, 3500 miles and £17k below list and I told him what I was prepared to pay. Think it was up at £530 per month on P.C.P. and I ended up with the same deposit and just under £400 p/m, nobody needs to pay 10.9% APR. And I P/Ex'd a shabby 1 series too. Unfortunately it was robbed within 12 hrs of me getting it and Paul managed to source me an exact same spec car, bar the colour, before it went online on the same deal. I looked for 3 weeks on AUC for a car in the only 2 colours I wanted and exact spec, to no avail. They get access to the lists of cars before they go live. So if you know what you want and what you're prepared to pay, it's always an option.
Let a good salesman do the leg work for you as I tried others and if the car wasn't in stock they wasn't interested
Really sorry to hear that - absolute scum car thieves.

What model was stolen out of interest? It's normally M cars that are targeted, but seeing a big increase in more general German marque theft, especially by house break-ins and grabbing keys.
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      06-25-2020, 03:16 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith_C View Post
They smashed my patio door lock and took the keys. First thing I did when I picked the next one up was get a Autowatch Ghost fitted before I got it home.
Absolute scum. Any kind of car crime, vandalism or theft really p****s me off! Obviously crime in general but that mentality of just taking or damaging whats not yours

Hope that nobody was hurt.
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