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2019+ BMW 3 AND 4-SERIES FORUMS (G2x Generation) General G80 M3 / G82 M4 Forum (2019+) Autocar: Next AMG C63 to ditch V8 for hybrid four-pot

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      10-17-2019, 09:47 AM   #1
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Autocar: Next AMG C63 to ditch V8 for hybrid four-pot

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https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/n...ybrid-four-pot

My thoughts on the article:

Based on comments made by Tobias Moers a couple years ago, it has been clear that the next generation of AMG vehicles in the Mercedes "C" family will ditch the V8 for a hybrid setup with fewer cylinders and less displacement.

However, the M256 inline six seemed like the most natural choice (to me, anyway) since it was designed from the start as a hybrid engine (ISG) for RWD applications and would apparently only need minimal attention to be upgraded from the middle tier seat it occupies in Mercedes "E" family of *53 vehicles at 430hp to a top tier seat in their "C" family with presumably 500hp+.

But now it appears the new M139 four cylinder may have been given the nod instead. This means it will gain an ISG setup like the M256 already has, and also be reoriented for longitudinal configuration. If true, this move is surprising for a couple reasons. First, the M139 is a very high strung engine, while the M256 has lots of room for growth - potentially to 600hp and beyond which is where the S58 will likely be heading by the middle of next decade (with the addition of a mild hybrid setup of its own, no doubt). Moreover, the perception here is going to be interesting for Mercedes to manage because their performance seeking clientele has traditionally been drawn in at least in part by higher displacement and cylinder counts than competitors.

I would have been completely convinced if the plan were described as a move to an I4 hybrid for the *43 vehicles while the *63 tier (perhaps with a new name, like *55) moved to the I6 hybrid. But the elimination of all engines with more than four cylinders across the whole lineup is a bit difficult to accept, even as electrification becomes more and more pervasive in performance applications.
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      10-17-2019, 09:59 AM   #2
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Next (2027?) M3/M4 will have to be hybrid as well, considering they will come out 2-3 years before most European cities ban gasoline & diesel cars. I just hope M goes with inline 6 hybrid, because BMW’s I6 engines are the best.
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      10-17-2019, 03:21 PM   #3
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I6 hybrid? Maybe a 48 volt starter mild hybrid at the beginning phase? Do you think G8X will get 48 volt mild hybrid?
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      10-17-2019, 03:39 PM   #4
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Good, the only reason to consider the C63 removed
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      10-19-2019, 02:47 AM   #5
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I'll take a big grill over a 4 pot any day...
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      10-19-2019, 07:51 AM   #6
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AMG has to realize that their customers are not as visionary as their engineers

The purchase of these cars is highly emotional, and I doubt the existing or potential customers will react kindly to "downgrading" C63 to A45 level, even if AMG engineers think it's not.
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      10-19-2019, 05:58 PM   #7
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Not good news for AMG fans. Don't know why anyone would shell out over $70k for a 4 cylinder.
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      10-19-2019, 08:50 PM   #8
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The only way I see this making sense is that the new i6 won't fit into a C Class without them making the car longer than they want. The v6 currently in the W205 is effectively end of its life now and won't be going into any new models.

It will be interesting to see (if this actually happens )how their sales figures change when the RS4/5 and M3/4 will still have 6 cylinders.
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      10-21-2019, 07:27 AM   #9
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Seems logical to have a 4 pot in the C43 and 6 pot in the C63, both hybrids. Only 4 cylinders in the C63 seems suicide.
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      10-21-2019, 07:31 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brad850csi View Post
The only way I see this making sense is that the new i6 won't fit into a C Class without them making the car longer than they want. The v6 currently in the W205 is effectively end of its life now and won't be going into any new models.

It will be interesting to see (if this actually happens )how their sales figures change when the RS4/5 and M3/4 will still have 6 cylinders.
They just don't have the balls to say nein zu EU-vorschriften.

Sales figure will be disastrous.
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      10-21-2019, 09:03 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brad850csi View Post
The only way I see this making sense is that the new i6 won't fit into a C Class without them making the car longer than they want.
And that is pretty doubtful given its trick belt-less design that makes it very compact by 3L I6 standards.

I'm still skeptical that they are going to skip right over the six cylinder and downsize the V8 straight to a four cylinder. I'll be following this closely.
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      10-24-2019, 12:03 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hegge View Post
Not good news for AMG fans. Don't know why anyone would shell out over $70k for a 4 cylinder.
Because you're not buying cylinders, you're buying a car.
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      10-24-2019, 07:36 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hegge View Post
Not good news for AMG fans. Don't know why anyone would shell out over $70k for a 4 cylinder.
I just can't imagine shelling out AMG money to get a four banger. Even if the performance is there, the overall experience is that of a WRX - fast but not premium.

AMG should talk to someone at Porsche before this happens. When they removed two cylinders from the Boxster & Cayman, sales plummeted.
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      10-24-2019, 08:30 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkoboe View Post
I just can't imagine shelling out AMG money to get a four banger. Even if the performance is there, the overall experience is that of a WRX - fast but not premium.

AMG should talk to someone at Porsche before this happens. When they removed two cylinders from the Boxster & Cayman, sales plummeted.
I heard they are seriously thinking of bringing back the NA six due to this.
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      10-25-2019, 09:18 AM   #15
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Don't believe everything you read...

The V8 will be back...it is the ethos of modern AMG and they know they need it so won't drop it just like that
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      10-25-2019, 09:18 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cortexiphan View Post
Because you're not buying cylinders, you're buying a car.
Uh yeah... Where the motor is is a huge part of the decision, especially in a sportscar trim.
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      10-25-2019, 09:22 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karmic Man View Post
The V8 will be back...
In the C family of AMG vehicles? At this point, the chances of that are so low that they don't register on the scale.

The V8 will live on in higher end models, though, yes. No doubt about that. In fact, if rumors are to be believed (and I'd say they should be), they are going to produce the hybridized version they've featured in show cars, to the tune of 800hp+.
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