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      11-01-2019, 12:08 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcintoshf30 View Post
It isn't gonna be M235.. it's going to be M240
No, it won't be an M240i. The new designation for 4 cylinder "performance" models is called '35i' (e.g. X2 M35i). The new 2 GC is based on the same FWD platform and will have the same 4 cylinder engine, hence M235i.
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      11-01-2019, 01:17 AM   #46
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BMW messed up the things really bad.

In top of all the mix and match between the series and platforms, they also put on their Canadian configurator main page real M's with the non M's models.
An M package doesn't mean M.

Why they couldn't put an S from Sport or whatever letter in there if they want it to make a "middle class" model?

So practically, in my opinion, they literally washed "the most powerful letter in the world" and diluted the perception of the M. Like, pretty bad!

And they did it themselves!
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      11-01-2019, 02:47 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OhMyXM View Post
I think anything below a 3 should not have the letter M on it. And I kinda think it's silly to offer an M and an M-Comp. Just call them M & make them the Competition version. I kinda think that's why we buying an M... I know it's to squeeze another 7-8 thousand bucks out of us because it's kinda a forgone conclusion that if we are gonna spend the money for an M, most will fork up the extra! Anyway, just my opinion.
They shouldn't put an M on anything with a 3 or higher number because they're all barges.
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      11-01-2019, 03:25 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SleepingBMW View Post
I'm with you. You can find them saying we would never do X on all their recent new products. Especially FWD.

Atleast it hasn't ruined the brand totally. It's not replacing anything so much as expanding the line up.

IMO, M as a brand is basically dead. Why not make a new 1M and pair it with a IMSA TCR race car which has mostly fwd cars anyway. Would expand the M division racing car offerings and clearly somebody likes FWD cars.

And tbh, Golf R is pretty fun. At this point to me the stupid grill M colors and M badges on every panel of every base 320i is more offensive to me than an AWD transverse M car.
When I ordered my 535i I ticked the M badge delete option. This got rid of the stupid badges on the front wings (fenders). I must have been one person in ten thousand who did so....
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      11-01-2019, 03:34 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akkando View Post
They shouldn't put an M on anything with a 3 or higher number because they're all barges.
We need a modern one of these
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      11-01-2019, 05:30 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akkando View Post
They shouldn't put an M on anything with a 3 or higher number because they're all barges.
My grandchild had an M135i for years and he systematically kept referring to it as "The M1". I finally stopped correcting him since he was convinced it was.

So in his mind his first car he owned was a M1. How great is that!
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      11-01-2019, 07:31 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 535i MSport View Post
We need a modern one of these
Interesting color... We didn't get that down here, afaik.
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      11-01-2019, 08:14 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Commanderwiggin View Post
Thank you BMW gods...we didn't need either of these options.
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      11-01-2019, 08:24 AM   #53
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It's good to know there is a limit to BMW's descent into irrelevance. Now if they could just remove the hideously large grilles on their new offerings and to back to having some dignity!
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      11-01-2019, 08:26 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marcva View Post
Interesting color... We didn't get that down here, afaik.
It's actually Estoril Blue, albeit not very accurately portrayed in the picture.
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      11-01-2019, 08:36 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 535i MSport View Post
We need a modern one of these
So, to be clear. We agree with BMW here. an M2 GC does not make sense. We want a 4 door M2. Shorten the front door, put in a B pillar for structural rigidity and put in a back door. It makes it easier to load your track tires, occasional short-distance passengers (kids love it) or dog. Porsche-like performance with *enough* of an accessible back seat...NOT a 5 passenger sedan, which the new 3er has become. You've got a great new E39 on the way, where's the E36/E46? More of a practical Sports Car than a fast sedan.

I'm going to keep pointing to Paul's renderings for reference.


Last edited by marcva; 11-01-2019 at 08:46 AM.. Reason: elaboration
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      11-01-2019, 08:37 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marcva View Post
So, to be clear. We agree with BMW here. an M2 GC does not make sense. We want a 4 door M2. Shorten the front door, put in a B pillar for structural rigidity and put in a back door. It makes it easier to load your track tires, occasional short-distance passengers (kids love it) or dog.

I'm going to keep pointing to Paul's renderings for reference.

[IMG]https://cdn.bmwblog.com/wp-content/u...0-1024x682.jpg[/IMG]
That's it!
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      11-01-2019, 08:44 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KoenG View Post
What's difficult to understand and what is hypothetical about the argument?
As I said, the ship has already sailed. By the time BMW decides they are ready to build a FAAR M, and goes through the development process, the market will have moved on. We are talking about 2026 at the earliest for the next generation 1 Series and 2 Series Gran Coupe to arrive. A small RWD or RWD-biased AWD car is going to have much higher appeal to the enthusiast market than one that is FWD or FWD-biased AWD. And the former is exactly what electric drive will yield by that time.

Quote:
When the A45 AMG and RS3 are capable to realise great sales figures, it is only a matter of time before we'll see an equivalent BMW M offering.
They already do. Well, we don't have raw numbers but we are talking about products being renewed over multiple generations in the VAG case, and both they and Mercedes are adding multiple new form factors. It's obvious the market exists.

Quote:
Exactly the same happened with the SUVs. M was never into that, until they saw the competition running away with their customers
BMW was one of the first to market with a luxury SUV, and experimented with high performance SUVs before most of if not all of the competition. What came late was the M branding. The rest was already in the pipeline.
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      11-01-2019, 11:28 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 535i MSport View Post
I think there should be an E36 sized 4 door M car......
This!

I owned a 98 M3/4/5. It was the most fun BMW ///M car I've ever driven. In many aspects, much more fun than my e46 M3 was. I haven't purchased an ///M car since because I wanted a semi-practical one with 4 doors. And the F80 M3 is just waaaaaaay too big for my taste. Feels like it's twice the size of e36 M3.

I was secretly hoping that BMW would make an M2 sedan at some point. I would be all over that car. Possibly two! One can only dream.
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Last edited by ///Mac; 11-01-2019 at 11:38 AM..
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      11-01-2019, 11:46 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
BMW messed up the things really bad.

In top of all the mix and match between the series and platforms, they also put on their Canadian configurator main page real M's with the non M's models.
An M package doesn't mean M.

Why they couldn't put an S from Sport or whatever letter in there if they want it to make a "middle class" model?

So practically, in my opinion, they literally washed "the most powerful letter in the world" and diluted the perception of the M. Like, pretty bad!

And they did it themselves!
Oh does this mean my M240i is a "real" ///M Car now! Yay!
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      11-01-2019, 11:52 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marcva View Post
So, to be clear. We agree with BMW here. an M2 GC does not make sense. We want a 4 door M2. Shorten the front door, put in a B pillar for structural rigidity and put in a back door. It makes it easier to load your track tires, occasional short-distance passengers (kids love it) or dog. Porsche-like performance with *enough* of an accessible back seat...NOT a 5 passenger sedan, which the new 3er has become. You've got a great new E39 on the way, where's the E36/E46? More of a practical Sports Car than a fast sedan.

I'm going to keep pointing to Paul's renderings for reference.
If you just want seats for occasional short distance passengers, why is pulling the seat up to get someone in / out of a coupe THAT much effort? I get that everyone wants a SUV / SAV / anything higher off the ground so it's easier for "modern bodies" to get in and out of ... but is a coupe now really considered unworkable because no one is willing / able to get into the back seat of one? Not sure I'd want to put an elderly person in the back if my 2er, but no one has had a problem getting in and out.

If someone wants a big, lumbering 4 door M car, there are already PLENTY of choices.
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      11-01-2019, 12:04 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkDemma View Post
If you just want seats for occasional short distance passengers, why is pulling the seat up to get someone in / out of a coupe THAT much effort? I get that everyone wants a SUV / SAV / anything higher off the ground so it's easier for "modern bodies" to get in and out of ... but is a coupe now really considered unworkable because no one is willing / able to get into the back seat of one? Not sure I'd want to put an elderly person in the back if my 2er, but no one has had a problem getting in and out.

If someone wants a big, lumbering 4 door M car, there are already PLENTY of choices.
It's not like that at all.

Often times the coupe version of an ///M car is nearly identical in length, width, and weight to the sedan version. Case in point, e36 M3 coupe vs e36 M3 sedan or e90 M3 vs e92 M3 (sedan's 3724 lbs vs the coupe's 3704), etc. were all within roughly 20-30 lbs of each other.

The reason some of us prefer sedans has nothing to do with the extra "effort" required to fit people in the back. It's about everyday practicality. The rear seats in a coupe and the leg room is simply not on par with the sedan.

Nobody is "lumbering" anything, since the extra 2 doors add virtually no extra weight or size. The doors in the coupe are always elongated to make up for what would have otherwise been 4 doors with a shorter quarter panel and rear end.
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      11-01-2019, 12:06 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Commanderwiggin View Post
Thank you BMW gods...we didn't need either of these options.
Thank god they're not gonna make a FWD car
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      11-01-2019, 03:19 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 535i MSport View Post
We need a modern one of these
Yea that would be awesome. I just bought an e90 M3 and I wish it was smaller. I think if the M2 came with 4 doors like the RS3 I would just have bought that and own one car instead of two.
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      11-01-2019, 04:40 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akkando View Post
Yea that would be awesome. I just bought an e90 M3 and I wish it was smaller. I think if the M2 came with 4 doors like the RS3 I would just have bought that and own one car instead of two.
It's annoying that Audi can do a 4 door fast car and fast tourings too, but BMW prefer not to.
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      11-01-2019, 04:51 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KoenG View Post
My grandchild had an M135i for years and he systematically kept referring to it as "The M1". I finally stopped correcting him since he was convinced it was.

So in his mind his first car he owned was a M1. How great is that!
That's so sad. He didn't add an ///M badge to the grille as well did he?
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      11-01-2019, 07:52 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 535i MSport View Post
That's so sad. He didn't add an ///M badge to the grille as well did he?
No, no need to for it, there are plenty m-badges all over the car! Exactly this was his argument: "When it's not an M, why are there referrals to it every where you can look!?".

Not sad at all, ignorance is bliss! Or a child hand is filled with some candy, even when the child is 30+.

Actually, the badge doesn't matter, we all know a 'real' M is a real M and not a M performance. But we're no children. So who is blessed?
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