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2019+ BMW 3 AND 4-SERIES FORUMS (G2x Generation) General G20 Sedan / G22 Coupe / G26 Gran Coupe Discussions 330i M Sport Package Test Drive Review: Its fine I guess?

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      02-10-2019, 07:31 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by MT4life View Post
Yes I love standing behind the trunk and waving my foot under the bumper to open, which works half the time

But all of that is worth it when I have a 6 speed manual 6 cylinder with MPPSK that screams at me.
Do you have any experience with old school BMW 6 cylinder naturally aspirated like the M54 and N52? If not do if any of your friends/family get one, it is a very different experience than the new age 6 cylinder turbo.

Obviously Model 3 the alleged 3-series killer is on the radar of many BMW enthusiasts, so it is worth checking out.
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      02-10-2019, 07:36 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by openwheelracing View Post
Must have that gesture controlled Android Auto subscription, head up display on top of 12.3" fake analogue display, neon lighting package with club mode, tempered glass moon roof with sudden shatter feature, satellite radio, already outdated map, comfort access with XXL fob, auto park feature that can't properly find a spot, power lift trunk on a sport sedan, "premium" sound as if Harmon is premium, wifi hot spot because I am a walking tech guru can't figure out how to enable my phone's hot spot, and my favorite: 600 miles range for each tank of premium gas.

But hey, that premium 4 banger is premium of all 4 bangers in BMW lineup.
A $28k F30 320i does not have any of fluff listed above, except for that magical 500-600 miles range with premium 91 gas(well some at work routinely mix AKI 89 and still get 500-600 miles/tank on their painful daily commutes), what is not to like?

Now if someone pays $40k-$45k for the same 320i with the extra fluff, then .... oh well, it will be understandable why so much anger from such person.
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      02-10-2019, 07:38 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by bavarianride View Post
Do you have any experience with old school BMW 6 cylinder naturally aspirated like the M54 and N52? If not do if any of your friends/family get one, it is a very different experience than the new age 6 cylinder turbo.
I had a E90 328i 12 years ago with the N52. The engine was loud yet I wasn't going anywhere fast. In a word, it sucked. If that's your idea of where you want BMW to head then no thanks.
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      02-10-2019, 07:40 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by praxis218 View Post
I had a E90 328i 12 years ago with the N52. The engine was loud yet I wasn't going anywhere fast. In a word, it sucked. If that's your idea of where you want BMW to head then no thanks.
That is exactly the point(repeated by many), namely, the old school I6 N/A feels fast, the new age I4 turbo is fast.

While those old school I6 N/A really really screams at you, the new age I6 turbo is quite tame, so it is not as emotional as the I6 N/A.

One gets to reason why go with unemotional I6 turbo, while the unemotional I4 turbo is just as, u know, unemotional.
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      02-10-2019, 07:56 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by bavarianride View Post
Do you have any experience with old school BMW 6 cylinder naturally aspirated like the M54 and N52? If not do if any of your friends/family get one, it is a very different experience than the new age 6 cylinder turbo.

Obviously Model 3 the alleged 3-series killer is on the radar of many BMW enthusiasts, so it is worth checking out.
Yes I had e46 330ci and e90 330i, I'm familiar and agree they were different but similar in its i6 smooth sweet sounding performance. F30 328 and 330 I drove as service cars both sounded like my mom's sewing machine. No 4 cylinder for me
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      02-10-2019, 08:04 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by MT4life View Post
Yes I had e46 330ci and e90 330i, I'm familiar and agree they were different but similar in its i6 smooth sweet sounding performance. F30 328 and 330 I drove as service cars both sounded like my mom's sewing machine. No 4 cylinder for me
Fair enough. Someone just told me today that any decision you make is always the right decision for you.
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      02-10-2019, 10:38 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by MT4life View Post
What do I need a heated steering wheel and heated rear seats for in the south? Lol
So don't add them then! It's not that difficult.
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      02-11-2019, 12:12 AM   #52
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bmw.co.uk G20 configuration appears to match(or close to) bmwusa in terms of ala carte(or lack of).

UK(and Germany?) used to be playground of ala carte, that appears not the case anymore for G20.

https://www.bmw.co.uk/configurator
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      02-11-2019, 12:17 AM   #53
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So don't add them then! It's not that difficult.
If in doubt, just custom order to exact spec!
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      02-11-2019, 01:40 AM   #54
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I don't get all the 4 cylinder hate.

Once cars started getting to 60 mph in about 6-7 seconds it was probably enough for most people. Given how powerful modern small displacement engines with turbos are, you probably could get to 7 second with the i8's 3 cylinder engine.

Now the n46 makes plenty of power for probably 99% of people. It makes more power than the E36 m3, e90 330i etc.

If they put an i-6 in it with no turbos it would get much worse epa milage. Then people wouldn't buy it because it wouldn't be competitively priced. If they put an i-6 with turbos in it, it would weigh and cost more more, and make far more power than most people really need AND still use more gas, which most buyers also don't want.

So people are complaining about

A. they have to pay for class competitive modern luxuries / standard feature, or
B. they want a 340i for the price of a 330i.

It's not even a bad value and is pretty competitive compared to other BMWs of the past

The car base costs only $41k. In 2019. It has a ton of standard equipment. I remember when I got out of college buying the then "value" 2005 G35 coupe. A guy I knew bought an 04 e46 325i sedan. I actually test drove one too and a 330i. Yes the engine felt very smooth. It had 184 hp and got to 60 in maybe mid 7s. It did not feel fast. The backseat was cramped, the stock stereo was pretty terrible, the base seats were terrible and the 16" wheels were terrible. The MSRP for a base with an auto was just over $30k. That is.... not shockingly CPI inflation adjusted $41k. The G20 at $41k... is much less terrible a value than that and much more competitive with its rivals. BMW thanks for the value. Competition is good.

Last edited by hans007; 02-11-2019 at 01:58 AM..
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      02-11-2019, 01:49 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hans007 View Post
I don't get all the 4 cylinder hate.

Once cars started getting to 60 mph in about 6-7 seconds it was probably enough for most people. Given how powerful modern small displacement engines with turbos are, you probably could get to 7 second with the i8's 3 cylinder engine.

Now the n46 makes plenty of power for probably 99% of people. It makes more power than the E36 m3, e90 330i etc.
It's not enough because the rest of the industry has increased HP across the line. 6-7 sec is now merely average.

If I want to overtake someone on the highway to squeeze into a spot to change lanes, I should be able to tap the pedal and shoot into it without inconveniencing anyone. I'm willing to pay for that privilege instead of being cucked by a family sedan that's just as fast as a 4 banger BMW.
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      02-11-2019, 01:53 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hans007 View Post
I don't get all the 4 cylinder hate.

Once cars started getting to 60 mph in about 6-7 seconds it was probably enough for most people. Given how powerful modern small displacement engines with turbos are, you probably could get to 7 second with the i8's 3 cylinder engine.

Now the n46 makes plenty of power for probably 99% of people. It makes more power than the E36 m3, e90 330i etc.

If they put an i-6 in it with no turbos it would get much worse epa milage. Then people wouldn't buy it because it wouldn't be competitively priced. If they put an i-6 with turbos in it, it would weigh and cost more more, and make far more power than most people really need AND still use more gas, which most buyers also don't want.
Also don't forget I6 turbos are not 50/50, e.g. B58 is 51/49 and N55 is 51.5/48.5.

Those few % put 100lb-ish permanently over the front axle, how much fun is that at curve?

In contrast 328i/330i is 50/50, and 320i(F30) is even head light.
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      02-11-2019, 02:01 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MT4life View Post
Yes I had e46 330ci and e90 330i, I'm familiar and agree they were different but similar in its i6 smooth sweet sounding performance. F30 328 and 330 I drove as service cars both sounded like my mom's sewing machine. No 4 cylinder for me
This.
Have had many BMWs including E36, E46, E90, E82, and now an F30 340i. While I understand that some great BMWs actually have had 4cyls (many do not know that the original M3 was actually a 4 cylinder), in my view a major part of BMW's DNA has been their mastery of the inline 6 motor. The B58 I-6 turbo in the 340i is just absolute brilliance, probably my favorite motor in any car I have ever had, even over the N/A I6's. Every time I have it in for service and get a loaner 330i, the 4cyl is a sad reminder of what can be, and the sound is awful. While I understand the use of it, not interested. If some like it, that is their thing. The performance is certainly there, they are quick and all. But the whole experience is not even in the same realm. Not even close!!! The I6 has some soul to it, screaming with pure brilliance through high revs and creating a totally different experience. The 4 cyl is just. The okayest motor.
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      02-11-2019, 02:23 AM   #58
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Originally Posted by golf_234 View Post
This.
Have had many BMWs including E36, E46, E90, E82, and now an F30 340i. While I understand that some great BMWs actually have had 4cyls (many do not know that the original M3 was actually a 4 cylinder), in my view a major part of BMW's DNA has been their mastery of the inline 6 motor. The B58 I-6 turbo in the 340i is just absolute brilliance, probably my favorite motor in any car I have ever had, even over the N/A I6's. Every time I have it in for service and get a loaner 330i, the 4cyl is a sad reminder of what can be, and the sound is awful. While I understand the use of it, not interested. If some like it, that is their thing. The performance is certainly there, they are quick and all. But the whole experience is not even in the same realm. Not even close!!! The I6 has some soul to it, screaming with pure brilliance through high revs and creating a totally different experience. The 4 cyl is just. The okayest motor.
I would say both I6 and I4 are part of BMW's DNA(just look at Munich's HQ, although they do rename/relabel as 4 batteries these days).

The B58 has improved NVH than outgoing N55, as BMW engineers turned the engine around and made TC/oil filter and such facing the firewall. That is a strong statement of BMW engineer's faith on LT reliability, as any TC fix is engine-out, just like N47 fiasco.

The loaner I4 experience can be marred by adaptive transmission(which memorizes the awful rental drivings), next time do try to reset the transmission and create your experience from scratch, u may actually like it.
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      02-11-2019, 06:33 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MT4life View Post
Would rather have vinyl seats no sunroof 340 than a fully loaded 4 cylinder.
as someone whos had both a 4cyl and 6cyl F30, the real world street performance is negligible and offset by the weight difference so id happily take a better specced 4cyl than a peasant spec 6cyl.
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      02-11-2019, 06:40 AM   #60
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Originally Posted by ThatKrazyPolak View Post
And BTW, those "useless gimmicks" are in fact, still useless gimmicks.
so a sunroof is a useless gimmick? news to me
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      02-11-2019, 07:50 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by Sherweeeny View Post
so a sunroof is a useless gimmick? news to me
For me it is but that is the beauty of the German brands, there are so many combinations possible
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      02-11-2019, 08:47 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bavarianride View Post
I would say both I6 and I4 are part of BMW's DNA(just look at Munich's HQ, although they do rename/relabel as 4 batteries these days).

The B58 has improved NVH than outgoing N55, as BMW engineers turned the engine around and made TC/oil filter and such facing the firewall. That is a strong statement of BMW engineer's faith on LT reliability, as any TC fix is engine-out, just like N47 fiasco.

The loaner I4 experience can be marred by adaptive transmission(which memorizes the awful rental drivings), next time do try to reset the transmission and create your experience from scratch, u may actually like it.
Actually funny enough have the 340i in for service and have a 330i loaner now, I'll give it a try.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sherweeeny View Post
as someone whos had both a 4cyl and 6cyl F30, the real world street performance is negligible and offset by the weight difference so id happily take a better specced 4cyl than a peasant spec 6cyl.
As another who also has this experience, own 340i, drive a lot of the 330i's from service, friends, etc, I can agree to some degree but definitely not fully. On paper you are generally right, and you are also right that people who judge others for going the route one way or the other, are lame. People's choices are their own and I always like leaving it at that.

Where I think you are wrong is in objectively comparing the actual experience each of those cars as similar. Simply not fair. When you really put the looking glass on it, the 340i is absolute brilliance, from sound to power delivery to the zf 8 speed, it is quite near perfect. Brilliance is the word I would use to describe that car.

The 330i , yes, it is good, but not even remotely would I give it that same kind of review. Totally different purpose and style of car. Is it nice yes, would I call it close to providing the same experience as the B58 6 Cyl, not in any sense. Drive both back to back and really observe the experience that you have critically and with detail, and it is not a fair thing to compare. Proper advice would be, both are nice, and they appear similar on paper, but are an absolutely different experience, and a person really needs to drive both extensively to form an opinion. Much more than back in the day when it was more or less just scaled versions of N/A i6's
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      02-11-2019, 09:15 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by golf_234 View Post
This.
Have had many BMWs including E36, E46, E90, E82, and now an F30 340i. While I understand that some great BMWs actually have had 4cyls (many do not know that the original M3 was actually a 4 cylinder), in my view a major part of BMW's DNA has been their mastery of the inline 6 motor. The B58 I-6 turbo in the 340i is just absolute brilliance, probably my favorite motor in any car I have ever had, even over the N/A I6's. Every time I have it in for service and get a loaner 330i, the 4cyl is a sad reminder of what can be, and the sound is awful. While I understand the use of it, not interested. If some like it, that is their thing. The performance is certainly there, they are quick and all. But the whole experience is not even in the same realm. Not even close!!! The I6 has some soul to it, screaming with pure brilliance through high revs and creating a totally different experience. The 4 cyl is just. The okayest motor.
Right, back in the day 235HP E30 M3 was amazing. That was also the time when Camry and Accord had 112HP.
Nowadays with ~250HP Accords and Camrys, 4 cylinder just doesn't cut it for 50K
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      02-11-2019, 01:38 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by MT4life View Post
Right, back in the day 235HP E30 M3 was amazing. That was also the time when Camry and Accord had 112HP.
Nowadays with ~250HP Accords and Camrys, 4 cylinder just doesn't cut it for 50K
they still have an m3. it just costs more money just like it always has. when a 4 cylinder Camry had 125 HP in the early 90s you could buy a 320i here which cost more money and had what 148hp.

today a 2019 4 cylinder Camry has 203 HP and a g20 has 255. it seems roughly still equivalent ratio of HP

my father actually had a v6 Camry in 95 which made 188hp. it made about what a 325i had. it was still a Camry and drove like one with more HP. it still cost less than BMW just like today
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      02-11-2019, 03:46 PM   #65
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I agree with a base 340i being a better "value" for us. However, upgraded audio is a "need" (a BMW need, not a real need) for me.
I wish I could just order a base 340 with that. Try adding HK audio to anything and the price jumps $5k from packages required...

I would be perfectly happy with a base 340 with HK and comfort access for let's say 58-59k, but BMW doesn't allow that.
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      02-11-2019, 03:51 PM   #66
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I agree with a base 340i being a better "value" for us. However, upgraded audio is a "need" (a BMW need, not a real need) for me.
I wish I could just order a base 340 with that. Try adding HK audio to anything and the price jumps $5k from packages required...

I would be perfectly happy with a base 340 with HK and comfort access for let's say 58-59k, but BMW doesn't allow that.
Let's see how bad it really is in G20. Even though I got HK stereo in my current car I can't imagine the base one is so terrible, maybe I'm wrong
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