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      05-18-2020, 04:40 AM   #485
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Yet another video of the new M4 driving around the Nürburgring. I like the shots on the streets, though. Gives better perspective of the overall stance.

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      05-18-2020, 07:03 AM   #486
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Auto, auto auto auto auto auto


Test some manuals FFS!!!
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      05-18-2020, 08:15 AM   #487
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Yet another video of the new M4 driving around the Nürburgring. I like the shots on the streets, though. Gives better perspective of the overall stance.

MC1 2011 and MD1 2016 seem to have ZF8 while MC1 1995 has DCT.

You can hear the throttle engagement is noticeably slower than 1995 at full throttle.

At 5:36, MC1 1995 makes identical sound to F8X test mules in bimmerpost video from years ago.
At 1:03

Hope this variation becomes the final transmission for RWD auto.

Last edited by kyrix1st; 05-18-2020 at 08:25 AM..
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      05-18-2020, 09:51 AM   #488
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I love how flat that G82 corners. That thing is going to be a hoot to drive.
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      05-18-2020, 10:08 AM   #489
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Damn, no CSL-style rear decklid anymore?
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      05-18-2020, 10:16 AM   #490
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlejoEvo View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by SabineBimmer View Post
Just saw a YouTube video about the 3.0 CSL Homage. Is BMW trying to emulate that car with the large grilles? If so, I could warm up to the new sizes but still feel they could've/should've done better.

I can live with the large grills and the new headlights if I got one of those!! 😂😂
Amen
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      05-18-2020, 10:38 AM   #491
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Sometimes when I read some of these posts, I asked myself if people forget that BMW has always been considered as "sport-luxury". Not "sports car" or "luxury" but "sport-luxury". Posts here would make one think that BMW always made a lesser-911 equivalent. :
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      05-18-2020, 10:44 AM   #492
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Sometimes when I read some of these posts, I asked myself if people forget that BMW has always been considered as "sport-luxury". Not "sports car" or "luxury" but "sport-luxury". Posts here would make one think that BMW always made a lesser-911 equivalent. :
Because it did.

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      05-18-2020, 10:51 AM   #493
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Originally Posted by pbar View Post
Yes - I'd be willing to bet that 90% of people on this forum would jump at that design. There are a few who are fully brainwashed into the "you'll get used to whatever our BMW overlords think will sell the most" mentality, but that CSL hommage makes me *want one* - in the same way that every 10-y-o kid wants a Lamborghini.
Well yeah, but it's a concept that hasn't had contact with safety regulations and fleet CO2 limits etc.

I agree BMW design could do better, but getting something that actually passes all regulation checks (like pedestrian safety) and still looks nice is apparently way harder than we all think.
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      05-18-2020, 10:56 AM   #494
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This thread has a chance to be the most debated discussion in history before BMW officially releases the new generation M4.
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      05-18-2020, 10:56 AM   #495
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyrix1st View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls View Post
Sometimes when I read some of these posts, I asked myself if people forget that BMW has always been considered as "sport-luxury". Not "sports car" or "luxury" but "sport-luxury". Posts here would make one think that BMW always made a lesser-911 equivalent. :
Because it did.

Maybe I worded my post wrong but while you'll find comparisons online, I don't think it was even BMW's intention to compete with the 911's of the world. They're just different cars IMO.

If someone asked which sports car to buy, I wouldn't list any BMW. On the flip side if you asked me which car for daily driving duties with some performance, I wouldn't list Porsche.
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      05-18-2020, 01:08 PM   #496
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls View Post
Sometimes when I read some of these posts, I asked myself if people forget that BMW has always been considered as "sport-luxury". Not "sports car" or "luxury" but "sport-luxury". Posts here would make one think that BMW always made a lesser-911 equivalent. :
Questionable.

The M3 was conceived to go racing. M = Motorsport, not luxurysport
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      05-18-2020, 01:30 PM   #497
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls View Post
Sometimes when I read some of these posts, I asked myself if people forget that BMW has always been considered as "sport-luxury". Not "sports car" or "luxury" but "sport-luxury". Posts here would make one think that BMW always made a lesser-911 equivalent. :
Questionable.

The M3 was conceived to go racing. M = Motorsport, not luxurysport
I guess it's how you and everyone else interprets BMW M(otorsport).

For me, no M car was supposed to be a hardcore, sports car. It was to show that you were able to combine sport performance with every day drive ability - but never to the full extent where a 911 would and could provide. At the end of the day, whether it's a M3, M4, M5, yeah it might have that "Motorsport" badge, but they also had the bells and whistles to cater to those looking for a luxury car.
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      05-18-2020, 01:33 PM   #498
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I looked at the video and the car looks stable and really fast, that's something I like!

I took some snapshots of the car, I think we will get a large grill but it will not be connected to the part under the license plate.

Also, the new headlights looks good!
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      05-18-2020, 01:48 PM   #499
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls View Post
I guess it's how you and everyone else interprets BMW M(otorsport).

For me, no M car was supposed to be a hardcore, sports car. It was to show that you were able to combine sport performance with every day drive ability - but never to the full extent where a 911 would and could provide. At the end of the day, whether it's a M3, M4, M5, yeah it might have that "Motorsport" badge, but they also had the bells and whistles to cater to those looking for a luxury car.

Everyone is allowed to see the M3 as they want but objectively the M3 was conceived to go racing not to be a luxury car. If you are talking about non M cars and the M5 then yes, agreed.

When people with long history with the brand complain that the M3 is being fitted with components not optimal for racing they have all the right to do so and have history to back them up. Opposite to what you elude to.

Of course, the component really need to be suboptimal in performance not “feel”. If for example the car is blistering fast on track with the ZF AT and it can handle hour after hour of track duty the complaint is not really valid from this angle

Last edited by solstice; 05-18-2020 at 02:03 PM..
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      05-18-2020, 02:14 PM   #500
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlejoEvo View Post
I looked at the video and the car looks stable and really fast, that's something I like!

I took some snapshots of the car, I think we will get a large grill but it will not be connected to the part under the license plate.

Also, the new headlights looks good!
Looks wide, butch and menacing with a surprisingly low look to the frontal area.
The haters are going to miss out...
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      05-18-2020, 02:25 PM   #501
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlejoEvo View Post
I looked at the video and the car looks stable and really fast, that's something I like!

I took some snapshots of the car, I think we will get a large grill but it will not be connected to the part under the license plate.

Also, the new headlights looks good!
It will be connected!!!! This is no longer a debate anymore.
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      05-18-2020, 02:38 PM   #502
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Everyone is allowed to see the M3 as they want but objectively the M3 was conceived to go racing not to be a luxury car. If you are talking about non M cars and the M5 then yes, agreed.

When people with long history with the brand complain that the M3 is being fitted with components not optimal for racing they have all the right to do so and have history to back them up. Opposite to what you elude to.

Of course, the component really need to be suboptimal in performance not “feel”. If for example the car is blistering fast on track with the ZF AT and it can handle hour after hour of track duty the complaint is not really valid from this angle
Of course anyone can interpret a car any way they like, but it doesn't remove the fact that cars like the M3/M4 are not supposed to directly 911 competitors because their focus was never the same as Porsche. Again, sure they have that M badge on them meaning there's more performance from the base model, but they're still offered with those luxury bells and whistles - that's the whole point of any and all BMW's.

I'm not saying you're wrong, because you're strictly looking at the M badge which is only one aspect of the car - performance, but there's a reason why all M cars are not made in only "CS" or "CSL" trim. The reason why most people look at BMW's is because they offer both the sport/performance aspect, mixed with luxury - it's not one or the other.

Last edited by TheBingoBalls; 05-18-2020 at 02:48 PM..
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      05-18-2020, 03:01 PM   #503
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlejoEvo View Post
I looked at the video and the car looks stable and really fast, that's something I like!

I took some snapshots of the car, I think we will get a large grill but it will not be connected to the part under the license plate.

Also, the new headlights looks good!
It will be connected!!!! This is no longer a debate anymore.
That's what I think from looking at the photos, but if you have information that you want to share is welcome.
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      05-18-2020, 03:07 PM   #504
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlejoEvo View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlejoEvo View Post
I looked at the video and the car looks stable and really fast, that's something I like!

I took some snapshots of the car, I think we will get a large grill but it will not be connected to the part under the license plate.

Also, the new headlights looks good!
It will be connected!!!! This is no longer a debate anymore.
That's what I think from looking at the photos, but if you have information that you want to share is welcome.
We've already seen official [leaked] photos of the grille (...and the rear bumper), received information from insiders, seen the concept front end, read BMW's statements, seen the two grilles through mesh on transport trucks, etc. The fact that there are two elongated mesh/slatted pieces hasn't been a debate for months now. We've moved past that phase of acceptance.
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      05-18-2020, 03:08 PM   #505
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls View Post
Of course anyone can interpret a car any way they like, but it doesn't remove the fact that cars like the M3/M4 are not supposed to directly 911 competitors because their focus was never the same as Porsche. Again, sure they have that M badge on them meaning there's more performance from the base model, but they're still offered with those luxury bells and whistles - that's the whole point of any and all BMW's.

I'm not saying you're wrong, because you're strictly looking at the M badge which is only one aspect of the car - performance, but there's a reason why all M cars are not made in only "CS" or "CSL" trim. The reason why most people look at BMW's is because they offer both the sport/performance aspect, mixed with luxury - it's not one or the other.
The same can be said about the 911, including that not all are made in “GT3” or “GT2” trim. The constraints of the M3 vs. the 911 is mainly budget and practicality not so much intent of luxury vs sport.

I wouldn’t necessarily say a 911 is less luxurious than an M3 or that an M3 is historically less sporty than a 911. GT models excluded of course.

Last edited by solstice; 05-18-2020 at 03:14 PM..
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      05-18-2020, 03:18 PM   #506
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Everyone is allowed to see the M3 as they want but objectively the M3 was conceived to go racing not to be a luxury car. If you are talking about non M cars and the M5 then yes, agreed.

When people with long history with the brand complain that the M3 is being fitted with components not optimal for racing they have all the right to do so and have history to back them up. Opposite to what you elude to.

Of course, the component really need to be suboptimal in performance not "feel". If for example the car is blistering fast on track with the ZF AT and it can handle hour after hour of track duty the complaint is not really valid from this angle
Of course anyone can interpret a car any way they like, but it doesn't remove the fact that cars like the M3/M4 are not supposed to directly 911 competitors because their focus was never the same as Porsche. Again, sure they have that M badge on them meaning there's more performance from the base model, but they're still offered with those luxury bells and whistles - that's the whole point of any and all BMW's.

I'm not saying you're wrong, because you're strictly looking at the M badge which is only one aspect of the car - performance, but there's a reason why all M cars are not made in only "CS" or "CSL" trim. The reason why most people look at BMW's is because they offer both the sport/performance aspect, mixed with luxury - it's not one or the other.
I understand your point, but the M3/4 we have today has changed from the E30 M3. The first M3 was oriented for performance first. Today you have a luxury car with great performance, which is good but not what was originally intended.
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