02-06-2019, 02:32 PM | #243 |
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You shouldn't celebrate too early. January sales fell across the board for everyone, not just Model 3. People don't buy in January especially when it's freezing outside.
Having inventory does not mean no one is buying. During December, they also had plenty of inventory ready to go. They are just shipping overseas now. Price drop is good for future buyers too, especially considering how well the Model 3 maintains resale value.
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02-06-2019, 03:17 PM | #244 | |
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https://insideevs.com/tesla-model-3-...-europe-20000/ |
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02-06-2019, 03:52 PM | #245 |
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They were building thousands of cars for Europe (just now arriving into Zeebrugge, next stop Bremerhaven - the names we're so used to seeing in the reverse order), so it's not clear how many were available on the U.S. market at all.
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02-06-2019, 04:17 PM | #246 | |
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One friend said the current buying experience is like shopping for a TV at BestBuy/Frys in store. |
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02-07-2019, 12:12 AM | #247 | |
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Do you sleep at night with BMWs sitting on dealership lots? Oh my God, you can actually take home a blue Model 3P LR AWD tomorrow morning. What an awful car it must be. |
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02-07-2019, 12:19 AM | #248 | |
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Finally the Tesla buying experience matches the ease of BMW buying experience, and that is a plus. |
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02-08-2019, 09:41 AM | #249 |
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Thinking back to grade school and the commutative principle, does this suggest BMW 3 Series shoppers open to EVs should be checking out the Kia showroom, and not for Stinger, this time?
https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...paign=15946319
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02-08-2019, 09:50 AM | #250 |
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Exactly my point. A review of Kia EV with a title including "Tesla Model 3". That's all you need to know. The star of the review, is obviously a Tesla, not a Kia. In this day and age, you have to understand how click baits work.
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02-08-2019, 10:17 AM | #251 |
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Click bait indeed.
Another great idea for C&D - review the $35k Kia Sportage, noting in the article title that there is no $35k BMW 320i available today, and then suggest those who want to purchase the RWD sport sedan instead consider the FWD SUV. |
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02-08-2019, 11:32 AM | #252 |
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For a thread titled "G20 versus Model 3" on a BMW G20 subforum, the star obviously is G20.
But since a comparison of Kia and G20 (without 320i!) is brought up, one should note that there are comparison of i-Pace and Model 3 in print. Also, another data point is, the guy at work in fact was going to buy a Model 3 P, but was more impressed by i-Pace than Model 3 P, but hey let's rip that apart as heresy too, why not? And obviously if click bait is suspected, then do not click let alone post. |
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02-08-2019, 11:57 AM | #253 | ||||
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https://electrek.co/2018/10/03/tesla...-pressure-bmw/ Let's be smart. We can have a reasonable discussion, but let's not even remotely imply we know more about what is going on in the marketplace than BMW's own corporate leadership. Tesla and the Model 3 absolutely are disruptive forces for BMW and other traditional players, and such forces absolutely do lead to unpleasant realities for the BMW community and other automotive communities. Thank you for acknowledging this and not making it about some school-yard popularity contest. Quote:
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Furthermore, the forums are organized in a hierarchy for a reason, and we appreciate when you do your best to post information where it belongs. Off-topic posts are subject to removal. Quote:
Thanks for enjoying Bimmerpost, and have a great day. |
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02-08-2019, 12:00 PM | #254 |
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For those more knowledgeable about the tactics of click bait, presumably in the pursuit of website revenue, how does the subsequent opinion piece praising the Niro add to the author's/website's benefit if you suspect it is less than sincere?
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02-08-2019, 12:24 PM | #255 | |
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But it and its manufacturer, Kia, do not grab attention like Tesla does. As the author of the article notes in his first sentence: "It's not right that the Kia Niro EV comes with not even a whiff of the anticipation that swirled around the Chevy Bolt EV ahead of its launch, nor the star appeal of anything Tesla." He's right - Kia/Hyundai deserve more props for being early to market with EVs (even if they are nevertheless still selling them only in Cali-compliance states). Unfortunately he bolsters the phenomena with which he expresses dismay by dedicating headline real estate to Tesla in what is an otherwise quality article about a good yet distinctly non-Tesla product. Look, this isn't remotely the worst example of "click-bait", but we can still call a spade a spade. The Niro is the first affordable all-electric SUV (though unfortunately lacking an available AWD configuration like almost every ICE SUV has), and is absolutely a great alternative to 200+ mile EV hatchlets like the Bolt and Leaf e+. A sport sedan, however, it is not. |
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02-08-2019, 01:02 PM | #256 | |
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The relevance of G20(or even G01 X3) in this thread and discussion of this nature is that, G20 is the way that BMW says it is pissed off, and that is a great thing for enthusiasts EV or ICE alike. Non-sense/garbage comparisons or otherwise can be subjective(even amidst objective numbers). The bottom line is the consumers have the final say, so Tesla opponents and proponents running smear campaigns against each other(just like the political landscape these days) do not work for those clear headed folks who pick EV/ICE/BMW/Tesla(etc, etc) based on their assessments. The point is to be respectable, and appreciative, of other's views and choices, that's the attribute valued by many(well at least me). On the subject of Tesla, my view is that, their greatest strength since day one is SV tech, not mainstream auto manufacturing, and they have made huge bets on EAP and FSD and such. Those not working seamlessly allows Tesla product lineups(S/X/3) to be threatened by deep-pocket competitors, e.g. i-Pace/upcoming Taycan and the like nibbing at the high end(Model 3 P, S, X), plus 200-mile Leaf@$26k after incentives put a solid wall on the low end, and Model 3@$50k demand is trending down. That is the current state, which is dynamic on day-to-day basis. It is fair to say arm chair discussions from anyone on this quality forum and others are still arm chair. This is said with certainty as any insider with real knowledge will not disclose anything on a public forum like this. Anyway, those are my arm chair views, and have a nice day. |
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02-08-2019, 01:32 PM | #257 | |||
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02-08-2019, 02:26 PM | #258 |
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The most prudent thing to do if we want to keep this conversation productive is stop comparing EVs just because they're EVs. The market has matured beyond the point where this made sense. No one puts RAV4 and 330i into the same comparison so we shouldn't do that with the Niro EV and Model 3. No one puts 340i and Mercedes GLE into the same comparison so we shouldn't do that with Model 3 and i-Pace.
Much more useful would be to include G26 BEV in this conversation. Granted, we know very little about it at this point (G20 LWB platform, 80KWh battery, single or dual motor) but until it comes to market there will literally be no direct competitor to Model 3. Not a single other car sold for $40K-$75K today can seat five, provide comfortable long distance cruising, while at the same time offering the dynamics of a true sports car. The latter point should be especially important to the audience here, and it's highly surprising that most anti-Tesla posters in this thread are completely ignoring it. The G26 could finally bring all of the above in a car not built by Tesla. The only questions are: will BMW be able to build electric powertrains as good as Tesla's, how much will the car cost, and how much progress will Tesla make in the two years before G26 is released? The answers will likely depend on two factors: the overall efficiency of the G26 package (BMW should hit 300Wh/mile warm weather average) and the battery pack cost (Tesla has something like 20%-40% lead over everyone else right now - BMW must get within 20%). Two other things I'm intentionally leaving aside for two opposite reasons. First, build quality is not an issue, because I have zero doubts that in two years Tesla's build quality will be on par with BMW. Second, I don't think we can meaningfully discuss future autonomous driving capabilities since it's totally unclear how much they will factor into average buyers' decision and how much progress the two companies will make. |
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02-08-2019, 03:35 PM | #259 |
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My concern with G26, is BMW has more incentive to push that car up market with premium cost over the sea of 330i and 340i. So when it is released in 2020+, without a huge infrastructure for batteries and dedicated EV production line, the price will be at a premium.
Tesla though, is already there with the Model 3 minus some quality control and customer service. I am driving a black Model 3 right now on a extended test drive. The car handles better than all my previous BMWs, and the interior makes more sense by the day. |
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02-08-2019, 07:24 PM | #260 | |
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02-08-2019, 09:17 PM | #261 | ||
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02-12-2019, 10:07 AM | #262 | ||
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Way more expensive to make i8 than i4 |
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02-12-2019, 12:24 PM | #263 | |
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Spare parts are hard to come by and stories of people losing their Teslas to their "approved" body shops for minor repair work that can take months and generate staggering repair bills. You can find stories in the Tesla forums. The cars might look and drive great but pray that you will never have a problem or that someone runs into you.
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02-12-2019, 01:27 PM | #264 |
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You can find way more of the same type stories right here on bimmerpost. Tesla is no worse. Actually, my personal experience with my local Tesla service center has been better than with the BMW dealership.
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