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2019+ BMW 3 AND 4-SERIES FORUMS (G2x Generation) General G20 Sedan / G22 Coupe / G26 Gran Coupe Discussions M340i vs G70 3.3T Sport Comparo. Hits 3.8s 0-60 in Instrumented Test.

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      11-10-2019, 08:25 PM   #221
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Originally Posted by Liquid_Ice View Post
I think its funny that every publication basically says the BMW is better but that it is more expensive.

Sure MSRP to MSRP it is more expensive - but hopefully nobody pays MSRP. I realize its probably hard for magazines to figure out the "street price" of a car especially since there isn't always a "norm" on pricing - but for anyone reading these articles they need to do a little research.

The M340i can easily be had for 10% off MSRP, some people have even gotten more - and BMW has been offering additional incentives on top of that for leases. When you consider that the residual is almost 10% higher, your monthly payment is about the same between a $50K G70 and a $60K M340i.

Time will tell how depreciation treats these cars for people buying - but if the BMW actually depreciates less you might be better off buying the M340i too since it will be worth more when you sell it. Hard to tell on this though and BMWs usually depreciate a lot over time - but I don't think Genesis depreciation would be like a Lexus!

But you're better off leasing the M340i over the G70 from a money perspective.
Genesis inherits all the characteristics from parent company hyundai; they're disposable cars, worth nothing after 3 years and thus appealing to second-hand buyers. BMW will have better depreciation, but having owned three in the past outside of warranty, I don't want to deal with the high upkeep costs ever again.

I think German cars are best to be leased due to the high upkeep required once initial warranty runs out and this is where Lexus wins, great resale value and low upkeep costs makes them perfect for financing and keeping longterm.
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      11-11-2019, 05:14 AM   #222
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Originally Posted by joshuastein55 View Post
Gotta remember, you can probably swing a good deal on the G70 (just look at the prices on Stingers), so the gap in pricing could still be there, even after M340 incentives/deals.
I did some research and the average discount on a Genesis G70 is 8.5% off MSRP which is what I used for lease payment calculation and a 10% off MSRP for the M340i. I didn't include incentives since they can change month to month and not everyone qualifies for them but the BMW has more incentives if you get the loyalty incentive.

I shared my numbers pages ago in this thread, but nobody seemed to care
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      11-16-2019, 11:25 PM   #223
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You guys. Average Joe/Jane does not buy a car based on engine. That is the LAST thing they care about. Especially when 4turbos are as good as they are now. All they know about their engine is that they have to put gas in it and that isn't free which annoys them.
Average Joe or Jane will happily drive a Prius. We know that they have poor taste in regard to cars. It doesn't mean that we have to compromise our preferences.
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      05-18-2020, 08:06 PM   #224
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I used to think the G70 is comparable to a BMW M340, and actually bought one in October 2019. Like many of you have been guessing, I bought it due to price (I would have bought the BMW M340 if I could). With dealer discount, I got twin turbo V6 power, tons of tech that basically let it drive itself on the highway, and good looks for under $44k. A similarly specced M340 was north of $65k. I felt smart, for like a month.

After 2,700 mostly highway miles, the cost cutting became VERY apparent. Squeaks and rattles everywhere, with dealers not willing to fix them. Then came the sunroof rattles. Then I found out my headliner makes tons of noise because it is mostly glued on...and the glue melts on a sunny, 75 degree day.

Then my steering shaft's coupler broke and left turns became mildly terrifying. The Hyundai dealers (there are no standalone Genesis dealers) kept saying all this was normal and that "the manager's Sonata makes a sunroof noise, too". My steering was repaired on the 5th attempt, after I found the issue, and took a video of the loose coupler for them.

I finally found a semi-competent dealer, and they've had my car for a while. Depending on what happens next, I may find myself shopping for an M340. Seems more affordable than I remember with all the lease specials.

I even went for a test drive in a courtesy M340 with 5k miles on it. I assume courtesy cars are not treated so well, so it would be a good showcase of BMW durability vs Genesis. It was no contest. The M340 felt so much more solid. Like driving a bank vault. The suspension was firmer and a bit harsher than the G70...but it still felt better because of how much more solid it felt. It was also quieter at highway speed. I'm not sure how, but it also felt much, much, much faster than the G70, especially flooring it at 70mph. Whereas the G70 moves, the M340 took off like I was at a standstill.

This was all a very long winded way of saying...no, these two cars are in no way comparable. One is built like trash around a decent V6 and transmission by what I assume are underpaid North Korean laborers. The other feels like a precision built masterpiece the second you start driving.
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      05-18-2020, 09:10 PM   #225
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Well, most of us here don't ascribe to the Genesis claim of superior quality. My M340i has near 10k miles and feels as solid as new. I remember test driving the 3.3T a year ago followed by the 330i M Sport and I felt aside from the power difference the G20 was superior.

Often times, if one focus mainly on a cheaper price you will get an inferior product, happens in fashion, electronics, appliances etc. Yes, there are some exceptions but this is generally true.

PS. The M340i is significantly faster than the 3.3T despite what the specs say. We look forward to you joining the club.

Cheers!
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      05-18-2020, 09:41 PM   #226
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Originally Posted by the_rus View Post
I used to think the G70 is comparable to a BMW M340, and actually bought one in October 2019. Like many of you have been guessing, I bought it due to price (I would have bought the BMW M340 if I could). With dealer discount, I got twin turbo V6 power, tons of tech that basically let it drive itself on the highway, and good looks for under $44k. A similarly specced M340 was north of $65k. I felt smart, for like a month.

After 2,700 mostly highway miles, the cost cutting became VERY apparent. Squeaks and rattles everywhere, with dealers not willing to fix them. Then came the sunroof rattles. Then I found out my headliner makes tons of noise because it is mostly glued on...and the glue melts on a sunny, 75 degree day.

Then my steering shaft's coupler broke and left turns became mildly terrifying. The Hyundai dealers (there are no standalone Genesis dealers) kept saying all this was normal and that "the manager's Sonata makes a sunroof noise, too". My steering was repaired on the 5th attempt, after I found the issue, and took a video of the loose coupler for them.

I finally found a semi-competent dealer, and they've had my car for a while. Depending on what happens next, I may find myself shopping for an M340. Seems more affordable than I remember with all the lease specials.

I even went for a test drive in a courtesy M340 with 5k miles on it. I assume courtesy cars are not treated so well, so it would be a good showcase of BMW durability vs Genesis. It was no contest. The M340 felt so much more solid. Like driving a bank vault. The suspension was firmer and a bit harsher than the G70...but it still felt better because of how much more solid it felt. It was also quieter at highway speed. I'm not sure how, but it also felt much, much, much faster than the G70, especially flooring it at 70mph. Whereas the G70 moves, the M340 took off like I was at a standstill.

This was all a very long winded way of saying...no, these two cars are in no way comparable. One is built like trash around a decent V6 and transmission by what I assume are underpaid North Korean laborers. The other feels like a precision built masterpiece the second you start driving.
My 330i has numerous rattles coming from all over. That being said - material and build quality is excellent and car feels rock solid. The G70 does feel like a cheaper toy.

I do envy the G70’s overall steering feel though. It’s the only area where it’s noticeably better than the G20.
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      05-18-2020, 09:59 PM   #227
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Originally Posted by the_rus View Post
I used to think the G70 is comparable to a BMW M340, and actually bought one in October 2019. Like many of you have been guessing, I bought it due to price (I would have bought the BMW M340 if I could). With dealer discount, I got twin turbo V6 power, tons of tech that basically let it drive itself on the highway, and good looks for under $44k. A similarly specced M340 was north of $65k. I felt smart, for like a month.

After 2,700 mostly highway miles, the cost cutting became VERY apparent. Squeaks and rattles everywhere, with dealers not willing to fix them. Then came the sunroof rattles. Then I found out my headliner makes tons of noise because it is mostly glued on...and the glue melts on a sunny, 75 degree day.

Then my steering shaft's coupler broke and left turns became mildly terrifying. The Hyundai dealers (there are no standalone Genesis dealers) kept saying all this was normal and that "the manager's Sonata makes a sunroof noise, too". My steering was repaired on the 5th attempt, after I found the issue, and took a video of the loose coupler for them.

I finally found a semi-competent dealer, and they've had my car for a while. Depending on what happens next, I may find myself shopping for an M340. Seems more affordable than I remember with all the lease specials.

I even went for a test drive in a courtesy M340 with 5k miles on it. I assume courtesy cars are not treated so well, so it would be a good showcase of BMW durability vs Genesis. It was no contest. The M340 felt so much more solid. Like driving a bank vault. The suspension was firmer and a bit harsher than the G70...but it still felt better because of how much more solid it felt. It was also quieter at highway speed. I'm not sure how, but it also felt much, much, much faster than the G70, especially flooring it at 70mph. Whereas the G70 moves, the M340 took off like I was at a standstill.

This was all a very long winded way of saying...no, these two cars are in no way comparable. One is built like trash around a decent V6 and transmission by what I assume are underpaid North Korean laborers. The other feels like a precision built masterpiece the second you start driving.
Genesis feels a lot like Infiniti back in the mid 2000s. The BMW killer etc. I mean you got a lot and that was Infiniti at the peak of its powers.

So I bought a 2005 G35 coupe, since an E46 325i had literally 100hp less. I was 24 at the time and had no taste...a year later the bumpers on my white car were oddly getting darker than the metal parts because the paint was not very good, my friends still couldn't hear themselves in the car since it was so loud with tire roar and the center console squeaking.

And then having driven other friend's E46s and my roomate eventually getting an e46 m3.... it was pretty obvious that one of the cars was refined and expensive and you were getting more than raw numbers there. So you always get what you pay for.
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      05-19-2020, 09:22 AM   #228
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Originally Posted by alpinewhite3 View Post
My 330i has numerous rattles coming from all over. That being said - material and build quality is excellent and car feels rock solid. The G70 does feel like a cheaper toy.

I do envy the G70’s overall steering feel though. It’s the only area where it’s noticeably better than the G20.
Oh no. Have you attempted to fix the rattles yourself, or taken to the dealer? If so, were they willing to help, or were they dismissive?
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      05-19-2020, 10:05 AM   #229
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Oh no. Have you attempted to fix the rattles yourself, or taken to the dealer? If so, were they willing to help, or were they dismissive?
I have not taken the car to the dealer-but i'm also not one of those people where rattles would drive me absolutely crazy. It's just a disappointment and minor annoyance. Not worth the time/energy/multiple trips and ripping the car apart to get it sorted.

That being said, my dealership is great and I'm sure they would be absolutely willing to help and fix all of the rattles. When i had an alignment issue the tech went on a long test drive with me to figure out what needed to be done and everyone was nice and helpful. Then when i had my software updated, the SA and techs actually respected my wishes to not change my seat setting (the software update resets seat memory). It's personal attention to detail, professionalism and respect like that which i would miss if getting my car serviced at a Hyundai dealership. Not saying it wouldn't happened, but less likely. BUt i guess, some BMW dealers are hit or miss too.
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      08-07-2020, 12:00 PM   #230
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The question should be BMW 330 or G70. A lightly optioned 330 is the same price as a fully optioned 3.3T V6 G70.
C&D has to be crazy to think the M340 is that much faster than a G70. I have driven both and the M340 is a bit faster but not almost a full second faster.
Funny how so many think just because a car cost more it should be better. As long as the engineering ( BMW, Audi, and MB engineers hired to Genesis) have done their job than the car is good. Cost of a BMW may only be slightly more than the Genesis. Don't look at the list price but look at material/manufacturing cost. BMW bumper may cost us a thousand to buy but it only cost BMW $20 to manufacture. BMW can demand a much higher selling price because of cache but doesn't mean that it is that much more superior in engineering.
I don't have a Genesis but the arrogance in some of these posts are kind of ridiculous. Many reviews have given the G70 car of the year in 2019. if it was given to BMW everyone would be shouting it here. We should congratulate Genesis in making a competitor.
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      08-07-2020, 05:19 PM   #231
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It is a free market, you like Genesis buy it, you like BMW like us then buy it. Genesis guys feels that one gotta have more money than brains to buy the M340I. They claim with the significant savings alone it's a no brainer. That's their opinion and they're entitled to it. As far as quality, quality at least on the G70 has been questionable.

I spend lots of time on that forum just reading owners experiences. Genesis is not Toyota Lexus. I have test driven the 3.3T and the M340i is significantly faster period. Even the Genesis forums says it is and plus there's numerous cheap mod to make this car even faster. There's no need to take issue with what owners here have to say, what do you expect. If we didn't feel it's a superior product we would have opted for the 3.3T.
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      08-07-2020, 08:19 PM   #232
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Follow the history of Hyundai Motors, and if you are being objective, you will be impressed.
The Genesis brand has been killing it with award after award.
I wish BMW had their dependability scores, and unlike Lexus their cars are not boring.
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      08-08-2020, 07:27 AM   #233
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Impressed really by whom unless one was born 5 years ago, then sure. A few decades ago nobody in a right frame of mind would buy a Hyundai. They were very unreliable pos. Yes today all that has changed but if it weren't for the long warranty I doubt they would be where they are today. I'm not impressed, if they hadn't scouted BMW and Audi's engineer the G70 would not have been a contender.

If there's any car company to be impressed by it is Lexus. They killed it with the LS400 back in the day. Record sales, impressive quality etc. Today they may have rested on their laurels but they have proven to be a top contender in the luxury market. Genesis is a new comer and only time will tell if they prevail.

Awards means jack, Sales is what spells success. Lexus can build great cars. LFA is still legendary, better than anything Bmw has ever released. ISF was great, maybe not initially but they continue to improve it. The current GSF is great. Hell Chris HArris said it was a far better drivers car than the M5. Lexus can build exciting cars, they just tend to lean conservative.

They also do suspension and steering far better than BMW. Build quality is also superior to others in this sphere. Genesis is not even in the same realm. They make disposable cars that aren't worth shit after 4 years. Honda, Toyota, NIssan are the only Asian manufacturers with a great history. Those companies have built some impressive cars over the years. Certainly not Hyundai / Genesis, check back in 10 years.
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      08-08-2020, 08:29 AM   #234
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Impressed really by whom unless one was born 5 years ago, then sure. A few decades ago nobody in a right frame of mind would buy a Hyundai. They were very unreliable pos. Yes today all that has changed but if it weren't for the long warranty I doubt they would be where they are today. I'm not impressed, if they hadn't scouted BMW and Audi's engineer the G70 would not have been a contender.

If there's any car company to be impressed by it is Lexus. They killed it with the LS400 back in the day. Record sales, impressive quality etc. Today they may have rested on their laurels but they have proven to be a top contender in the luxury market. Genesis is a new comer and only time will tell if they prevail.

Awards means jack, Sales is what spells success. Lexus can build great cars. LFA is still legendary, better than anything Bmw has ever released. ISF was great, maybe not initially but they continue to improve it. The current GSF is great. Hell Chris HArris said it was a far better drivers car than the M5. Lexus can build exciting cars, they just tend to lean conservative.

They also do suspension and steering far better than BMW. Build quality is also superior to others in this sphere. Genesis is not even in the same realm. They make disposable cars that aren't worth shit after 4 years. Honda, Toyota, NIssan are the only Asian manufacturers with a great history. Those companies have built some impressive cars over the years. Certainly not Hyundai / Genesis, check back in 10 years.
If, if, if...
Hyundai/Genesis/Kia built their reputation on their focus and great leadership not only on extended warranty. Palisade/Telluride/ GV80 are amazing for the cost, G70/G80 are now luxury contenders...
And they continue to capture the market share.
I don't see anything impressive by Lexus. Feels like they tried, did not succeed and backed off. Just like Infiniti did at one point
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      08-08-2020, 09:33 AM   #235
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Go test drive a GSF or LC500 or find someone that has an LFA and report back. Lexus is still building great analog drivers car while the Germans and genesis aka the copy cat doing the turbo thing. BMW cars only win in tech and big power over Lexus. Lexus is still a profitable company. Genesis not so much. There is no legendary car built by Hyundai or Genesis period. G70 nor GV80 doesn't fit that declaration.

So many of you don't drive the competition and automatically assume lexus only makes fwd crossover and the ES/LS. Lexus 3IS was a far superior drivers car to the f30, bmw only won on power and tech then. Same for the GS350 versus the 5 series. There is nothing legendary about a G70. The GV80 hasn't even reach our shores yet. Look at their sales, they have numerous new cars over two years old collecting dust on dealer lots. Nobody wants them.

If Lexus builds a high performance IS in the next few years, I am out. BMW is not what it was for those of us who owned the earlier gems. I have a car that burns oil and is only driven on the street. This would never happen on any Lexus. So while I now drive an M340i I am no BMW fanboy. I drive the competition and knows even today Lexus still make some good driver's cars.

Can't believe In 2020 someone would argue the point that Hyundai does not have great history lol. I mean, a company that only recently start building some decent cars for the mainstream market. They're still nowhere to even overthrow Toyota lol. Now if you had said Honda, I would say hell yes. Cue the NSX, prelude, CRX, Integra, S2000, Legend etc etc. I am going to assume y'all meant to say Honda and not Hyundai / Genesis .

For 11 consecutive years up until 2011 Lexus was the top luxury seller in the USA. After the earthquake in Japan they fell to third place which is where they are now. Goes to show how much you know about Lexus and success. So, for a decade they were selling more cars than the Germans. They were the company to put the Germans on alert, not genesis. They've got years to to prove themselves since even today their market share is insignificant.
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      08-08-2020, 10:30 AM   #236
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I would have zero issues with buying a Genesis product, especially the G70. I would buy it over any Lexus, Acura, Lincoln, Cadillac, Infiniti, Audi or Volvo. They make great cars, period.
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      08-08-2020, 11:04 AM   #237
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Quote:
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Go test drive a GSF or LC500 or find someone that has an LFA and report back. Lexus is still building great analog drivers car while the Germans and genesis aka the copy cat doing the turbo thing. BMW cars only win in tech and big power over Lexus. Lexus is still a profitable company. Genesis not so much. There is no legendary car built by Hyundai or Genesis period. G70 nor GV80 doesn't fit that declaration.

So many of you don't drive the competition and automatically assume lexus only makes fwd crossover and the ES/LS. Lexus 3IS was a far superior drivers car to the f30, bmw only won on power and tech then. Same for the GS350 versus the 5 series. There is nothing legendary about a G70. The GV80 hasn't even reach our shores yet. Look at their sales, they have numerous new cars over two years old collecting dust on dealer lots. Nobody wants them.

If Lexus builds a high performance IS in the next few years, I am out. BMW is not what it was for those of us who owned the earlier gems. I have a car that burns oil and is only driven on the street. This would never happen on any Lexus. So while I now drive an M340i I am no BMW fanboy. I drive the competition and knows even today Lexus still make some good driver's cars.

Can't believe In 2020 someone would argue the point that Hyundai does not have great history lol. I mean, a company that only recently start building some decent cars for the mainstream market. They're still nowhere to even overthrow Toyota lol. Now if you had said Honda, I would say hell yes. Cue the NSX, prelude, CRX, Integra, S2000, Legend etc etc. I am going to assume y'all meant to say Honda and not Hyundai / Genesis .

For 11 consecutive years up until 2011 Lexus was the top luxury seller in the USA. After the earthquake in Japan they fell to third place which is where they are now. Goes to show how much you know about Lexus and success. So, for a decade they were selling more cars than the Germans. They were the company to put the Germans on alert, not genesis. They've got years to to prove themselves since even today their market share is insignificant.
I have driven both, ISF and GSF and totally uninspiring cars. Toyota dressed up. Cannot day anything about the others you mentioned. Not saying they are bad cars, far from that, but simply put,..boring.

Also, you are comparing fairly young company (Hyundai) that first 90% of its young lifetime solely focused on winning the trust of the lower middle class consumer and just last 5 years or so entered the sport/luxury market, with BMW heritage or Toyota???

I’d say they got a loooooong way if you look at G70 vs that Pony that was first introduced in the 90s...
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      08-08-2020, 11:50 AM   #238
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Ironic to find a GSF with a great sounding NA V8 boring but a Genesis appealing. Unless your only criteria is affordability. Facts are facts. Also I don't care for Hyundai period. Someone else proclaimed their great history which is laughable. Their history is that of a brand that made crap for decades and copied everybody else.

Lexus last year sold 10 million cars globally. In that same time Acura and Infiniti cumulative total sales was half that. Look, all I read is people being biased and making objective statements. Lexus is no Infiniti period. Infiniti has been a failure which is most likely the same path genesis will follow.

Genesis has been all hype and so far the sales numbers has not correlated to the hype. Again, those are facts. The upcoming GV80 will change that some but still no Lexus killer in terms of market share.
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      08-08-2020, 11:54 AM   #239
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Decent competition avoids complacency, a win for all those involved so if Hyundai / Kia etc. continue to evolve I'm grateful to them.

I've been tempted by a few other brands recently and it had little to do with money.
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      08-08-2020, 12:03 PM   #240
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This isn't an argument of brand versus brand. Who cares how much or little they sell in comparison. If the car is good, it deserves the praise its getting. Clearly they did their homework on the 3-series and hiring Biernmann helped out greatly. The G70 is a great car. Owner satisfaction and reliability has been very good for the Genesis brand. Some people just can't handle the fact that they are owned by Hyundai. If the F30 drove as well as the G70 we'd be congratulating BMW, but because its a Hyundai people have to put it down. We should be happy that there are still people who work at Hyundai/Genesis that actually care about fun to drive vehicles and are offering them to us rather than just making another cookie cutter SUV.
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      08-08-2020, 03:02 PM   #241
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the_rus View Post
I used to think the G70 is comparable to a BMW M340, and actually bought one in October 2019. Like many of you have been guessing, I bought it due to price (I would have bought the BMW M340 if I could). With dealer discount, I got twin turbo V6 power, tons of tech that basically let it drive itself on the highway, and good looks for under $44k. A similarly specced M340 was north of $65k. I felt smart, for like a month.

After 2,700 mostly highway miles, the cost cutting became VERY apparent. Squeaks and rattles everywhere, with dealers not willing to fix them. Then came the sunroof rattles. Then I found out my headliner makes tons of noise because it is mostly glued on...and the glue melts on a sunny, 75 degree day.

Then my steering shaft's coupler broke and left turns became mildly terrifying. The Hyundai dealers (there are no standalone Genesis dealers) kept saying all this was normal and that "the manager's Sonata makes a sunroof noise, too". My steering was repaired on the 5th attempt, after I found the issue, and took a video of the loose coupler for them.

I finally found a semi-competent dealer, and they've had my car for a while. Depending on what happens next, I may find myself shopping for an M340. Seems more affordable than I remember with all the lease specials.

I even went for a test drive in a courtesy M340 with 5k miles on it. I assume courtesy cars are not treated so well, so it would be a good showcase of BMW durability vs Genesis. It was no contest. The M340 felt so much more solid. Like driving a bank vault. The suspension was firmer and a bit harsher than the G70...but it still felt better because of how much more solid it felt. It was also quieter at highway speed. I'm not sure how, but it also felt much, much, much faster than the G70, especially flooring it at 70mph. Whereas the G70 moves, the M340 took off like I was at a standstill.

This was all a very long winded way of saying...no, these two cars are in no way comparable. One is built like trash around a decent V6 and transmission by what I assume are underpaid North Korean laborers. The other feels like a precision built masterpiece the second you start driving.
This right here is one of the major reasons I went with the M340i over the G70. Dealer network for Genesis leaves a lot to be desired. Sure there are some bad apples in the BMW dealer network, but not like there are in Hyundai/Genesis. Go to the G70 forums and just read some of the stories about dealership experience... I had a bad experience with a dealer when I went to test drive, which really turned me off of the brand. Overall, the interior of the G70 seemed nice and the exterior looked good, but I never drove so I can't comment on driving characteristics or durability.
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      08-08-2020, 04:39 PM   #242
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 440xiGCMSport2 View Post
The question should be BMW 330 or G70. A lightly optioned 330 is the same price as a fully optioned 3.3T V6 G70.
C&D has to be crazy to think the M340 is that much faster than a G70. I have driven both and the M340 is a bit faster but not almost a full second faster.
Funny how so many think just because a car cost more it should be better. As long as the engineering ( BMW, Audi, and MB engineers hired to Genesis) have done their job than the car is good. Cost of a BMW may only be slightly more than the Genesis. Don't look at the list price but look at material/manufacturing cost. BMW bumper may cost us a thousand to buy but it only cost BMW $20 to manufacture. BMW can demand a much higher selling price because of cache but doesn't mean that it is that much more superior in engineering.
I don't have a Genesis but the arrogance in some of these posts are kind of ridiculous. Many reviews have given the G70 car of the year in 2019. if it was given to BMW everyone would be shouting it here. We should congratulate Genesis in making a competitor.

It's so interesting how attitudes and perceptions on this board have changed so much over the years...or maybe the average BMW customer has just changed with the times.

I've been here long enough to distinctly remember when the IS350 and G35 were faster in a straight line than the e46 and e90 330i's and all hell broke loose on here constantly. Straight line performance and 0-60 times were regarded as the last metrics to judge a sport's sedan's overall performance.

G70 may have it's share of issues - but it's a better overall driving experience than the 330i. (and the 330i has a better steering rack than the 340) There's a reason it won motor trend's car of the year last year and on car and driver's 10 best. Have to give credit where credit is due.

And has anyone here driven the Veloster N? It's pulling M2C skidpad numbers with even sharper steering. This brand is doing great things and heading in the right direction.
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