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Technical Topics B48 4-Cylinder Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications [B46] Bootmod3 Stage 1 w/ 93 Octane on G20 First Impressions

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      01-15-2020, 01:10 PM   #133
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Originally Posted by VipinLJ View Post
I’ll try to find out. One of my cousins knows a few people who run JB+ and JB4 there without issues. I’ll get back to you. But I’m willing to bet they’re running 95 or 98 RON since fuel is cheap there. I’ll confirm and get back.
Cheers man.

Hopefully it’s 95 RON

Last edited by Razor2010; 01-15-2020 at 01:20 PM..
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      01-27-2020, 07:55 PM   #134
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Originally Posted by Razor2010 View Post
Thanks for the reply LJ. Not sure it’s wise I mess with that with only 91 AKI fuel and very hot and humid weather, sounds like a recipe for knock and detonation.
Why does this sound like Trinidad?
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      02-12-2020, 05:21 AM   #135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Razor2010 View Post
Also, still searching for the stock boost on a 2020 non-USA spec 330i, no luck yet. I would guess with the compression somewhere around 15 psi?
I put mine on the dyno a couple of weeks ago. It was 20psi (at 600m above sea level)
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      02-12-2020, 07:30 AM   #136
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Originally Posted by AustraliaG20 View Post
I put mine on the dyno a couple of weeks ago. It was 20psi (at 600m above sea level)
Wow, quite high, thank you.

100% stock?

What RON octane gas?
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      02-13-2020, 12:26 AM   #137
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Completely stock. It requires 95 RON, but I only run 98 RON. I was also surprised by how high it was (even confirmed the number didn't include atmospheric pressure), especially since it gets increased by all the chips / mods etc.
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      02-13-2020, 08:09 AM   #138
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Originally Posted by AustraliaG20 View Post
Completely stock. It requires 95 RON, but I only run 98 RON. I was also surprised by how high it was (even confirmed the number didn't include atmospheric pressure), especially since it gets increased by all the chips / mods etc.

Yea, I would be very nervous adding boost with an aftermarket device to where it could be upwards of of 23 PSI+ without some serious visual knock detection, high octane fuel and perfect mapping. Throw hot climate in there and this all seems like a recipe for disaster.
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      02-13-2020, 06:08 PM   #139
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Originally Posted by Razor2010 View Post
Yea, I would be very nervous adding boost with an aftermarket device to where it could be upwards of of 23 PSI+ without some serious visual knock detection, high octane fuel and perfect mapping. Throw hot climate in there and this all seems like a recipe for disaster.
Indeed. I have another thread about it. But I had a TDI Tuning chip in it, and was testing different setups (stock, different maps etc) to ensure it was as safe as possible. It was over 43 deg C that day too...
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      02-13-2020, 06:39 PM   #140
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Originally Posted by AustraliaG20 View Post
Indeed. I have another thread about it. But I had a TDI Tuning chip in it, and was testing different setups (stock, different maps etc) to ensure it was as safe as possible. It was over 43 deg C that day too...
Just re-read your thread. Wonder if it is an actual TDI product fault or if your car was just protecting itself, sensed knock or possibly detonation and pulled timing and boost and dumped a bunch of fuel to cool things off.

There is no free lunch out there, 2.0 litre engine (non-race car internal build), with pretty high compression, smaller turbo to bring boost on early, running 95-98 octane in high ambient temperatures and high boost (20 psi), fairly lean for good gas mileage, has to be on the brink for long term reliability at 255 BHP and 295 TQ.

One thing that was interesting is that the stock wheel HP was 240 on a supposedly low reading dyno, means the stock real BHP is more than the advertised 255, no?
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      02-13-2020, 07:12 PM   #141
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Your thinking is exactly like mine... basically lots of questions and I honestly don't have the answer. I'll get a new box back, I'll put it in and see if there is a difference. I had the box since July and it never really felt like it worked properly, so I'm leaning towards fault in the box / map. But yea; I'll know more when I get another one, and a higher model that allows remote map updates etc. I can't complain about the service from TDI and they're adamant it should perform better.

I was surprised about the stock power readings at the wheels. But having had similar cars (2L turbo etc) it feels (butt dyno) like the readings are about right to be honest... and BMW have under rated the power. It's worth noting that I have the launch edition with a build date of 11/2018 - seems like the earlier models might have been a bit different.
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      02-13-2020, 07:31 PM   #142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustraliaG20 View Post
Your thinking is exactly like mine... basically lots of questions and I honestly don't have the answer. I'll get a new box back, I'll put it in and see if there is a difference. I had the box since July and it never really felt like it worked properly, so I'm leaning towards fault in the box / map. But yea; I'll know more when I get another one, and a higher model that allows remote map updates etc. I can't complain about the service from TDI and they're adamant it should perform better.

I was surprised about the stock power readings at the wheels. But having had similar cars (2L turbo etc) it feels (butt dyno) like the readings are about right to be honest... and BMW have under rated the power. It's worth noting that I have the launch edition with a build date of 11/2018 - seems like the earlier models might have been a bit different.
I use to have a JDM RHD Sti7 bugeye with the 6 speed manual. Think it was claimed 276 bhp and similar TQ. Car weighed roughly 3,200 lbs. and was meant to run on 100 RON so I had it re-mapped for lower 95 RON along with changing to a fully decatted exhaust from the turbo back. I would imagine that with the safer remapp for 95 RON and free flowing exhaust it probably ended up back to about stock levels net. My 2020 330i with no-moonroof, M-Sport package and M-LSD is on a boat from Germany and should be arriving mid-March. With the no-moonroof option I am hoping it will be closer to 3,400 lbs. So curious how the 330i will feel in comparison to my old Sti7. I would imagine they will feel pretty close acceleration wise. Sti turbo didn’t kick in until about 3.8k rpms but had a redline at 8k. I am hoping the 330i is much more fun to drive around town with boost kicking in below 2k rpms. Really hoping the extra 200 lbs.+ of weight isn’t too noticeable. I know there are a lot of Sti7s down in Oz, you ever drive a Sti7 JDM spec?

What do you mean about the early build date, are they rumored to be higher rated from factory than recent builds?
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      02-13-2020, 09:08 PM   #143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustraliaG20 View Post
I put mine on the dyno a couple of weeks ago. It was 20psi (at 600m above sea level)
What was your ambient temperature? The boost gets much higher in very warm temperature. I would guess boost is 15-20 depending on temps.
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      02-13-2020, 09:11 PM   #144
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Originally Posted by sspdw View Post
What was your ambient temperature? The boost gets much higher in very warm temperature. I would guess boost is 15-20 depending on temps.
If you look at his TDI thread I think it was 95’F+ ambient temps!
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      02-13-2020, 09:44 PM   #145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Razor2010 View Post
If you look at his TDI thread I think it was 95’F+ ambient temps!
I did the conversion in the thread, but it was more like 110' F - I did mention it was the worst possible day to put it on a dyno.

Not driven the JDM or even that model STi, interested to see what you think.

Now the fires have died down and the temperature isn't horrific, I'll put the new chip in and run it again in a couple of weeks (after it arrives).
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      02-13-2020, 09:58 PM   #146
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Originally Posted by AustraliaG20 View Post
I did the conversion in the thread, but it was more like 110' F - I did mention it was the worst possible day to put it on a dyno.

Not driven the JDM or even that model STi, interested to see what you think.

Now the fires have died down and the temperature isn't horrific, I'll put the new chip in and run it again in a couple of weeks (after it arrives).
By JDM I meant the Japanese spec, Subaru WRX Sti7 as picture below:
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      02-22-2020, 08:47 PM   #147
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Here in Brasil people are tuning their g20s at a place called armada performance and others as well, quoting gains of about 350 hp and 50 nm torque for the 330i M sport.
Is there anyone one now that we can truly tune a 20?
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      02-22-2020, 09:53 PM   #148
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Originally Posted by claudioagmfilho View Post
Here in Brasil people are tuning their g20s at a place called armada performance and others as well, quoting gains of about 350 hp and 50 nm torque for the 330i M sport.
Is there anyone one now that we can truly tune a 20?
I’ve seen companies in Russia and Europe too that have been tuning G20 330is to 300+hp on stage 1 (only software; no hardware mods). I wish some of those people would join this forum and give us their insights.
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      02-27-2020, 11:34 AM   #149
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Just caught up reading all the responses on this thread, just want to clear up some questions and concerns:

The B46D is in all 330’s in NA, including my very own after checking the VIN. The quality of the B46D is the same as the B58, same compression ratio, same cylinder bore diameter, etc. The only difference is that it has SULEV parts installed on it in order to meet emissions requirements. The upgraded B48TU is used for stock 300+hp vehicles produced by BMW. This upgraded engine is made to push 300hp even while running lower than 91/93 octane. It is made so that while running low octane, the engine will still be able to make the same power. We can see this because of the lower compression ratio which is found on the engine. It has very little to do with reliability of engine, it has everything to do with gas quality, however.
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      02-27-2020, 11:48 AM   #150
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Originally Posted by g20beam View Post
Just caught up reading all the responses on this thread, just want to clear up some questions and concerns:

The B46D is in all 330’s in NA, including my very own after checking the VIN. The quality of the B46D is the same as the B58, same compression ratio, same cylinder bore diameter, etc. The only difference is that it has SULEV parts installed on it in order to meet emissions requirements. The upgraded B48TU is used for stock 300+hp vehicles produced by BMW. This upgraded engine is made to push 300hp even while running lower than 91/93 octane. It is made so that while running low octane, the engine will still be able to make the same power. We can see this because of the lower compression ratio which is found on the engine. It has very little to do with reliability of engine, it has everything to do with gas quality, however.
Thank you for this.

So the G20 330i, no matter where in the world has the B48D, which BMW didn't seem comfortable tuning to 300 HP or they would have used the same B48D in BMW vehicles producing 300HP instead of up-rating it to the B48TU, is that correct?

As you say, this is probably related to the fact that they have to account that certain regions don't have access to 95+ RON so to achieve that 300 HP stock on potentially lower octane fuels they had to dial down the compression to avoid knock / det - makes sense.

So again, tuning the B48D to 300HP is probably OK if you have access to 98+ RON fuel, don't live in a very hot climate and don't track your car.
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      02-27-2020, 02:33 PM   #151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Razor2010 View Post
Thank you for this.

So the G20 330i, no matter where in the world has the B48D, which BMW didn't seem comfortable tuning to 300 HP or they would have used the same B48D in BMW vehicles producing 300HP instead of up-rating it to the B48TU, is that correct?

As you say, this is probably related to the fact that they have to account that certain regions don't have access to 95+ RON so to achieve that 300 HP stock on potentially lower octane fuels they had to dial down the compression to avoid knock / det - makes sense.

So again, tuning the B48D to 300HP is probably OK if you have access to 98+ RON fuel, don't live in a very hot climate and don't track your car.
B46D. But yes, you’re correct. Theoretically because the B46D is basically B58 with 2 less cylinders, it should be reliable as long as you’re running 91/93 Octane with any Stage 1 or 2 tunes.
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      02-27-2020, 02:56 PM   #152
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Originally Posted by g20beam View Post
B46D. But yes, you’re correct. Theoretically because the B46D is basically B58 with 2 less cylinders, it should be reliable as long as you’re running 91/93 Octane with any Stage 1 or 2 tunes.
The information on my car shows a B48D / B48B20O1, not sure where the B46D is coming from at your end? Edit: I see that the 6 or 8 is depending on NA or outside of NA as you stated for the SULEV. See image below. I am obviously outside of NA hence the 8.

Also, don't understand the logic here. B58 is running 382 HP and 369 TQ, so 2 litres / 3 litres or 4 cyl / 6 cyl X 382 and 369 = 255 HP and 246 TQ. HP is almost bang-on and we are actually quite lucky to have 295 TQ based on our engine being down 1 litre and 2 cylinders on the B58. This engine is being pushed pretty hard right from factory so not sure how much room it has in a hot climate running 95 RON / 91 API octane, my guess is not much room at all safely.
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      03-01-2020, 11:23 AM   #153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Razor2010 View Post
The information on my car shows a B48D / B48B20O1, not sure where the B46D is coming from at your end? Edit: I see that the 6 or 8 is depending on NA or outside of NA as you stated for the SULEV. See image below. I am obviously outside of NA hence the 8.

Also, don't understand the logic here. B58 is running 382 HP and 369 TQ, so 2 litres / 3 litres or 4 cyl / 6 cyl X 382 and 369 = 255 HP and 246 TQ. HP is almost bang-on and we are actually quite lucky to have 295 TQ based on our engine being down 1 litre and 2 cylinders on the B58. This engine is being pushed pretty hard right from factory so not sure how much room it has in a hot climate running 95 RON / 91 API octane, my guess is not much room at all safely.
That’s because all these engines, the B46D, B48, the B58, are all great engines that BMW gave very conservative numbers on because of emissions requirements. This is the worst case scenario for B46D owners, because they added SULEV parts in the exhaust and engine, in order to hinder the performance of the car even more. All of the engines are heavily detuned because of emissions. I can see why going Stage 1 can be bad for the engine because there is too much built up pressure inside the turbo and DP due to the catalytic converter. You’re adding too much boost, but the cats are still in, therefore worse for the turbo. But if you added a catless downpipe and upgraded charge pipes, always ran 91 V-Power from Shell (In Canada so that is probably the best gas I can get from pump), and then put the car on Stage 2 OTS tune from BM3, it would be okay for the engine. And if you did your oil changes every 5K and changed to 5W40 instead of 0W20, I think all of this should be more on the reliable side. BM3 OTS maps are meant to be mosty very reliable compared to other custom maps or tunes.
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      03-01-2020, 12:32 PM   #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Razor2010 View Post
The information on my car shows a B48D / B48B20O1, not sure where the B46D is coming from at your end? Edit: I see that the 6 or 8 is depending on NA or outside of NA as you stated for the SULEV. See image below. I am obviously outside of NA hence the 8.

Also, don't understand the logic here. B58 is running 382 HP and 369 TQ, so 2 litres / 3 litres or 4 cyl / 6 cyl X 382 and 369 = 255 HP and 246 TQ. HP is almost bang-on and we are actually quite lucky to have 295 TQ based on our engine being down 1 litre and 2 cylinders on the B58. This engine is being pushed pretty hard right from factory so not sure how much room it has in a hot climate running 95 RON / 91 API octane, my guess is not much room at all safely.
Also, regarding the B46D, it is the engine code given to me and some of the others on this forum after we checked our VIN. The VIN decoder websites gives us the code B46D.
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