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      12-03-2019, 05:02 PM   #287
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      12-05-2019, 09:22 PM   #288
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If negotiating with a dealer to buy and we agreed to a sales price but now after speaking to wife contemplating leasing vs financing, does this negatively affect the deal for the dealer?

Im thinking id rather lease the car rather than finance. Just wondering if the deal would now change... rebates would change, but sales price was agreed. I obviously would have to confirm MF but all else should be equal no?

Thanks in advance
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      12-05-2019, 09:32 PM   #289
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Originally Posted by Tryboz View Post
If negotiating with a dealer to buy and we agreed to a sales price but now after speaking to wife contemplating leasing vs financing, does this negatively affect the deal for the dealer?

Im thinking id rather lease the car rather than finance. Just wondering if the deal would now change... rebates would change, but sales price was agreed. I obviously would have to confirm MF but all else should be equal no?

Thanks in advance
I would most likely want to restructure the deal depending on the numbers you got.
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      12-07-2019, 05:56 PM   #290
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A couple of questions for people who have ordered their bmw.

When ordering a car does your credit get run before you pick it up the car or right when you place the order and put the deposit down? I paid some bills recently which brought my utilization up and credit score to just below 700, should I just wait a few weeks before it goes back up before placing an order if it'll cost me a higher MF.

Another question that I can save for the dealer is that I want to do the PCD, I only live 70 miles from the plant but I'm also planning on trading my car in. What point do I give them my car for trade? I have my wife's car to get around but just curious.
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      12-08-2019, 08:04 AM   #291
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReaperKK View Post
A couple of questions for people who have ordered their bmw.

When ordering a car does your credit get run before you pick it up the car or right when you place the order and put the deposit down? I paid some bills recently which brought my utilization up and credit score to just below 700, should I just wait a few weeks before it goes back up before placing an order if it'll cost me a higher MF.

Another question that I can save for the dealer is that I want to do the PCD, I only live 70 miles from the plant but I'm also planning on trading my car in. What point do I give them my car for trade? I have my wife's car to get around but just curious.
It seems to vary by dealer. Some dealers won't run a credit check until you're ready to pick up the car/sign the final paperwork, and some require filling out a credit application before you place the order. It also seems to depend on the type of order you're placing. If you're requesting multiple individual options, they will most likely require credit check at time of placing the order.

On that note, shouldn't your utilization decrease if you've paid off bills? Unless you're paying these accounts off and closing them too. Or do you mean you paid off bills with credit cards?

Also, how are you verifying your credit? Are you relying on sites like credit karma? Or are you actually paying for your score through myFico? I would strongly suggest paying for myFico as that will give you your actual auto lending score, which is what manufacturers reference when issuing credit.

In regards to your trade in. I would strongly suggest you treat your trade in as a separate transaction. If you negotiate sale price of the car as well as your trade-in, the dealer will most likely try to justify offering you a "good" deal on one end by making it up on the other end (i.e. give you a good % off MSRP but then give you a terrible valuation on your trade-in or vice versa). But by treating them as 2 separate transactions (not even mentioning you're trading a car in at time of MSRP negotiations), you're ensuring the dealer doesn't muddy up the deal.

You will also benefit if you get sale quotes for your trade-in with other methods (i.e. carvana, vroom, carmax, etc). I found carvana to offer me the best value for my previous car when I was selling it. The dealer was offering me about $1,500 less than what carvana offered.
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      12-08-2019, 03:28 PM   #292
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Originally Posted by alex2364 View Post
Get out the lube. They're thinking you'll be okay with a similar payment for a lite M. I would pay no more than $600 with $0 down. You should hit up some of the forum dealers here and the other BMW site.
I need 15k miles/year and our sales tax is high here. So I'm not going to get even close to $600/mo especially considering I have to factor in my remaining payments on my current car. But that being said, they are clearly off base with such a ridiculous offer and I feel insulted honestly. She did not give a breakdown of the deal, just gave me the monthly payment and out-of-pocket. I'm convinced they aren't even running real numbers...they just picked a random monthly payment, threw it at me and are expecting me to just accept it like a dumbass
I guess now the question is, are you going to confront the salesperson about this? I think I might... but I'd go in with a deal for them to approve, instead of asking them for a revised proposal. Put an aggressive counter offer in front of them while telling them you're ready to buy, but you're disappointed and insulted by their original offer. If they can do your offer they'll take it.
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      12-08-2019, 05:20 PM   #293
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Originally Posted by wtwo3 View Post
It seems to vary by dealer. Some dealers won't run a credit check until you're ready to pick up the car/sign the final paperwork, and some require filling out a credit application before you place the order. It also seems to depend on the type of order you're placing. If you're requesting multiple individual options, they will most likely require credit check at time of placing the order.

On that note, shouldn't your utilization decrease if you've paid off bills? Unless you're paying these accounts off and closing them too. Or do you mean you paid off bills with credit cards?

Also, how are you verifying your credit? Are you relying on sites like credit karma? Or are you actually paying for your score through myFico? I would strongly suggest paying for myFico as that will give you your actual auto lending score, which is what manufacturers reference when issuing credit.

In regards to your trade in. I would strongly suggest you treat your trade in as a separate transaction. If you negotiate sale price of the car as well as your trade-in, the dealer will most likely try to justify offering you a "good" deal on one end by making it up on the other end (i.e. give you a good % off MSRP but then give you a terrible valuation on your trade-in or vice versa). But by treating them as 2 separate transactions (not even mentioning you're trading a car in at time of MSRP negotiations), you're ensuring the dealer doesn't muddy up the deal.

You will also benefit if you get sale quotes for your trade-in with other methods (i.e. carvana, vroom, carmax, etc). I found carvana to offer me the best value for my previous car when I was selling it. The dealer was offering me about $1,500 less than what carvana offered.
Thanks for the post! I check my credit through a paid experian account which gave me my FICO 8 and FICO 8 auto score. My utilization went up because I paid some medical bills with a CC, i've since paid my CC off but it'll be a couple of weeks before my balance updates to bring my back utilization down. I'll just end up and wait.

As far as my current car is concerned I was offered $22k for it through Genesis when I was looking for a G70 for myself, I stopped by a BMW dealership nearby where they gave me $19k but I didn't spend any time negotiating. I'd be happy with $22k as that is a few hundred less than my payoff.
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      12-10-2019, 08:28 AM   #294
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReaperKK View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by wtwo3 View Post
It seems to vary by dealer. Some dealers won't run a credit check until you're ready to pick up the car/sign the final paperwork, and some require filling out a credit application before you place the order. It also seems to depend on the type of order you're placing. If you're requesting multiple individual options, they will most likely require credit check at time of placing the order.

On that note, shouldn't your utilization decrease if you've paid off bills? Unless you're paying these accounts off and closing them too. Or do you mean you paid off bills with credit cards?

Also, how are you verifying your credit? Are you relying on sites like credit karma? Or are you actually paying for your score through myFico? I would strongly suggest paying for myFico as that will give you your actual auto lending score, which is what manufacturers reference when issuing credit.

In regards to your trade in. I would strongly suggest you treat your trade in as a separate transaction. If you negotiate sale price of the car as well as your trade-in, the dealer will most likely try to justify offering you a "good" deal on one end by making it up on the other end (i.e. give you a good % off MSRP but then give you a terrible valuation on your trade-in or vice versa). But by treating them as 2 separate transactions (not even mentioning you're trading a car in at time of MSRP negotiations), you're ensuring the dealer doesn't muddy up the deal.

You will also benefit if you get sale quotes for your trade-in with other methods (i.e. carvana, vroom, carmax, etc). I found carvana to offer me the best value for my previous car when I was selling it. The dealer was offering me about $1,500 less than what carvana offered.
Thanks for the post! I check my credit through a paid experian account which gave me my FICO 8 and FICO 8 auto score. My utilization went up because I paid some medical bills with a CC, i've since paid my CC off but it'll be a couple of weeks before my balance updates to bring my back utilization down. I'll just end up and wait.

As far as my current car is concerned I was offered $22k for it through Genesis when I was looking for a G70 for myself, I stopped by a BMW dealership nearby where they gave me $19k but I didn't spend any time negotiating. I'd be happy with $22k as that is a few hundred less than my payoff.
When I placed my order for my build I did a credit check prior to putting down my deposit etc to lock in the current rates I had negotiated with my dealer. It would be a waste of $2k if you put down the deposit and for some reason didn't get approved by BMWFS when you went to pick up the car and finalize the paperwork.

In order to get a 'top tier credit' deal, I was told by my local dealer a credit score of 740+ would qualify for that. However, I believe BMWFS will approve most people as long as they have above a 680 and don't have an absurd monthly payment amount. It also helps to put down some $ if you're credit is not the greatest.

I had to work on rebuilding my credit over the last few years from some mistakes when I was younger and dumber
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      12-10-2019, 09:33 AM   #295
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gdiddy23 View Post
When I placed my order for my build I did a credit check prior to putting down my deposit etc to lock in the current rates I had negotiated with my dealer. It would be a waste of $2k if you put down the deposit and for some reason didn't get approved by BMWFS when you went to pick up the car and finalize the paperwork.
Good point. If you want to lock in incentives/MF at time of order, then you should make it a point to fill out the credit app even if the dealer doesn't require it. That's doubly advantageous because then you get your pick of incentives/MF - you can choose to use the numbers from time of order, or at time of delivery, whichever is favorable.
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      12-10-2019, 04:01 PM   #296
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I'm likely turning in my 2017 M3 lease and getting a base-ish 330 lease. Really just want less cost, I have a fun weekend car and while the M3 is awesome, I was just sitting in traffic, never using it's capability.

Deal I was offered on a 2019 330 Loaner w 2,900 miles (I don't care about it being slightly used, it's a daily that will get turned in after lease is up)

MSRP $48,600
Sales price $42,500
15k miles / year
58% residual
0.00128 MF
$0 cap cost reduction
About $1,500 in fees are signing
Taxes rolled in (CT)

$524/ month

And they are taking my M3 back 3 months early. I'm at 46 K miles on allowable 45k total.

I also have the fleet discount to apply but have not brought that up yet.

How'd I do?
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      12-13-2019, 12:23 AM   #297
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin M View Post
I'm likely turning in my 2017 M3 lease and getting a base-ish 330 lease. Really just want less cost, I have a fun weekend car and while the M3 is awesome, I was just sitting in traffic, never using it's capability.

Deal I was offered on a 2019 330 Loaner w 2,900 miles (I don't care about it being slightly used, it's a daily that will get turned in after lease is up)

MSRP $48,600
Sales price $42,500
15k miles / year
58% residual
0.00128 MF
$0 cap cost reduction
About $1,500 in fees are signing
Taxes rolled in (CT)

$524/ month

And they are taking my M3 back 3 months early. I'm at 46 K miles on allowable 45k total.

I also have the fleet discount to apply but have not brought that up yet.

How'd I do?
Don't know how much this helps you, but was able to get a 46.5k sticker loaner down to 2k DAS and $323 including tax last week...

couple things to consider however, this included college grad and OL code incentives that surely not everyone has (added up to an additional $2k in incentives)... this was for a 10k/yr lease vs your 15, and lastly there was no other car being absolved into the deal..

again, not sure how much that helps, but figured it would give you some baseline that you could then plug some #'s into and see where you could possibly end up
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      12-13-2019, 03:27 PM   #298
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin M View Post
I'm likely turning in my 2017 M3 lease and getting a base-ish 330 lease. Really just want less cost, I have a fun weekend car and while the M3 is awesome, I was just sitting in traffic, never using it's capability.

Deal I was offered on a 2019 330 Loaner w 2,900 miles (I don't care about it being slightly used, it's a daily that will get turned in after lease is up)

MSRP $48,600
Sales price $42,500
15k miles / year
58% residual
0.00128 MF
$0 cap cost reduction
About $1,500 in fees are signing
Taxes rolled in (CT)

$524/ month

And they are taking my M3 back 3 months early. I'm at 46 K miles on allowable 45k total.

I also have the fleet discount to apply but have not brought that up yet.

How'd I do?
Revised deal on a new car

MSRP: $51,425
Sales price: $44,376
MF: 0.00128
15K miles (58% residual)
$0 cap cost reduction
$2K due at signing with all fees and first month

$525 / month incl 6% CT sales tax

Thats 13.7% off MSRP and they are taking my M3 back 4 months early. I feel pretty happy with this.

I was also told that you cannot combine fleet with loyalty credit. True?
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      12-13-2019, 03:33 PM   #299
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReRe View Post
Don't know how much this helps you, but was able to get a 46.5k sticker loaner down to 2k DAS and $323 including tax last week...

couple things to consider however, this included college grad and OL code incentives that surely not everyone has (added up to an additional $2k in incentives)... this was for a 10k/yr lease vs your 15, and lastly there was no other car being absolved into the deal..

again, not sure how much that helps, but figured it would give you some baseline that you could then plug some #'s into and see where you could possibly end up
thats an insane deal. I'm not even sure how you got it that low.

$2K cap cost reduction?

What was the sales price?
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      12-13-2019, 04:51 PM   #300
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin M View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ReRe View Post
Don't know how much this helps you, but was able to get a 46.5k sticker loaner down to 2k DAS and $323 including tax last week...

couple things to consider however, this included college grad and OL code incentives that surely not everyone has (added up to an additional $2k in incentives)... this was for a 10k/yr lease vs your 15, and lastly there was no other car being absolved into the deal..

again, not sure how much that helps, but figured it would give you some baseline that you could then plug some #'s into and see where you could possibly end up
thats an insane deal. I'm not even sure how you got it that low.

$2K cap cost reduction?

What was the sales price?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin M View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ReRe View Post
Don't know how much this helps you, but was able to get a 46.5k sticker loaner down to 2k DAS and $323 including tax last week...

couple things to consider however, this included college grad and OL code incentives that surely not everyone has (added up to an additional $2k in incentives)... this was for a 10k/yr lease vs your 15, and lastly there was no other car being absolved into the deal..

again, not sure how much that helps, but figured it would give you some baseline that you could then plug some #'s into and see where you could possibly end up
thats an insane deal. I'm not even sure how you got it that low.

$2K cap cost reduction?

What was the sales price?
No cap cost reduction, just $2k in drive offs!!

Dealer discount brought it down to $39k flat, and then $4750 in incentives.. so a final sales price of just over 34k which I think explains the lease payment
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      12-13-2019, 06:50 PM   #301
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin M View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin M View Post
I'm likely turning in my 2017 M3 lease and getting a base-ish 330 lease. Really just want less cost, I have a fun weekend car and while the M3 is awesome, I was just sitting in traffic, never using it's capability.

Deal I was offered on a 2019 330 Loaner w 2,900 miles (I don't care about it being slightly used, it's a daily that will get turned in after lease is up)

MSRP $48,600
Sales price $42,500
15k miles / year
58% residual
0.00128 MF
$0 cap cost reduction
About $1,500 in fees are signing
Taxes rolled in (CT)

$524/ month

And they are taking my M3 back 3 months early. I'm at 46 K miles on allowable 45k total.

I also have the fleet discount to apply but have not brought that up yet.

How'd I do?
Revised deal on a new car

MSRP: $51,425
Sales price: $44,376
MF: 0.00128
15K miles (58% residual)
$0 cap cost reduction
$2K due at signing with all fees and first month

$525 / month incl 6% CT sales tax

Thats 13.7% off MSRP and they are taking my M3 back 4 months early. I feel pretty happy with this.

I was also told that you cannot combine fleet with loyalty credit. True?
You didn't mention if turning in your M3 early is structured into your payments....
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      12-17-2019, 12:24 PM   #302
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Originally Posted by premier3is View Post
You didn't mention if turning in your M3 early is structured into your payments....
Its not. Not sure what they are doing with it, but I'm not responsible for any of the three remaining payments and I can't see where they are working it into new deal (deal seems ok standing on its own, I think).
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      12-18-2019, 05:09 AM   #303
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Its not. Not sure what they are doing with it, but I'm not responsible for any of the three remaining payments and I can't see where they are working it into new deal (deal seems ok standing on its own, I think).
One of two things happens: either the trade value is above the lease payoff amount (positive equity) and they apply this to the new lease, or, they're rolling the total of the three remaining payments into the new lease.
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      12-18-2019, 07:18 AM   #304
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Originally Posted by tgrundke View Post
One of two things happens: either the trade value is above the lease payoff amount (positive equity) and they apply this to the new lease, or, they're rolling the total of the three remaining payments into the new lease.
I can't see where they are rolling M3 lease payments into new lease, that would be $2,200 and I've itemized almost everything and can't see where that is showing up. Also, my payoff amount is $43K, and a 2017 M3 w 46K miles has a higher retail value. Two other dealers told me I had to make the 3 remaining lease payments.

BTW here is my breakdown of costs due at signing:

$525 first months payment
$255 tax on $2,750 rebates
$260 DMV fees
$925 bank fee
$75 doc fee
$2040 TOTAL DUE AT SIGNING
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      12-18-2019, 07:45 AM   #305
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin M View Post
I can't see where they are rolling M3 lease payments into new lease, that would be $2,200 and I've itemized almost everything and can't see where that is showing up. Also, my payoff amount is $43K, and a 2017 M3 w 46K miles has a higher retail value. Two other dealers told me I had to make the 3 remaining lease payments.

BTW here is my breakdown of costs due at signing:

$525 first months payment
$255 tax on $2,750 rebates
$260 DMV fees
$925 bank fee
$75 doc fee
$2040 TOTAL DUE AT SIGNING
Entirely possible they took the car as a trade and not a turn-in if there was equity. We did this with my wife's old CRV: the trade in value was $1,500 over the lease residual, so when we moved into a Grand Cherokee they took the CRV as a trade and used the $1,500 to cover fees on the new car.

Not common, but sometimes you get lucky.
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      12-19-2019, 12:51 PM   #306
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tgrundke View Post
Entirely possible they took the car as a trade and not a turn-in if there was equity. We did this with my wife's old CRV: the trade in value was $1,500 over the lease residual, so when we moved into a Grand Cherokee they took the CRV as a trade and used the $1,500 to cover fees on the new car.

Not common, but sometimes you get lucky.
Did the deal yesterday, they ate the remaining payments in hopes to sell the car on their lot and make some money.

Picked up the car. While its not an M3, its a very nice daily. Engine is definitely stronger than I expected.
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      12-22-2019, 09:05 AM   #307
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I was recently quoted the following:

2020 BMW M340i XDrive:
MSRP: $64,575
Discount: 10% off MSRP pre-incentive
36 Months / 12K Miles
Monthly Payment: $599 w/tax
Drive-Off Amount: $2400 ($400 in CCR which I don't agree with)
Additional Drive-Off: $4200 for max of 7 MSDs
MF: 0.00148- dealer will not go to base
Residual: 60%
Incentives: $3000 (BMW - $1K Lease Credit / $2K Loyalty

Region/Taxes: PA / 9%

Thoughts?
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      12-22-2019, 01:00 PM   #308
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATL0501 View Post
I was recently quoted the following:

2020 BMW M340i XDrive:
MSRP: $64,575
Discount: 10% off MSRP pre-incentive
36 Months / 12K Miles
Monthly Payment: $599 w/tax
Drive-Off Amount: $2400 ($400 in CCR which I don't agree with)
Additional Drive-Off: $4200 for max of 7 MSDs
MF: 0.00148- dealer will not go to base
Residual: 60%
Incentives: $3000 (BMW - $1K Lease Credit / $2K Loyalty

Region/Taxes: PA / 9%

Thoughts?
I don't even waste time with dealers who won't honor the base MF, especially since you're also putting down max MSD's. IMO that's complete BS and most dealers I've worked with will honor base MF of 0.00128 from beginning. Just my 2 cents
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2019 Shelby GT350R (Weekend)
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