[quizly6]

I have been scrolling through forums for the past couple months on m340’s performance wise. I decided to purchase a 2020 model for ecu tunability + the exhaust. After putting about 1,500 miles on the car 30 days in, I absolutely love it.

There is a debate going on about whether it’s a baby M car, or just a beefed up 330i.

In my opinion, the car handles extremely well and is straight up fast in a straight line. I understand it is not a true m car, but to call it a tuned 330i is just ridiculous to me. I also drive a g82 m4, and have driven the prior f82 m4 extensively as well.

In my honest opinion, I absolutely hated the f82 m4. Sounded horrible, didn’t drive that well, although the looks of the car are stunning. Can’t tell a huge difference in speed between the two, however I know f8x is slightly faster.

The G82 is hands down better in every single way possible than the m340i, as well as f8x. Car drives like an absolute dream. Handling is so precise it feels like an extension of my own body. This is a true M car.

In my opinion, the m340i is also worthy of the M badge. Not a true M car, but definitely closer to an M3 than a 330i. It just digs into corners, and that exhaust is beautiful. Proper fast, and proper fun to drive.

Interested to hear others thoughts. I don’t understand why other M drivers love to bash this car.

[tturedraider]

So, is it ///M car owners you’re seeing call an M340i a tuned 330i?? Personally, I have never read that in this forum. Mainly because the 330i has a four banger under the hood and the M340i has an inline six. Saying that about the M340i makes no sense.

[bavarianride]

I think a M car does have extra chassis bracing that M performance cars like M340i does not have, so in that context M340i is not true M.

On the other hand, a M340i for sure is not a 330i given the extra HP/lb-ft and the matching extra cost.

It should be fair to say M340i is somewhere between 330i and M3.

[Llarry]

"Tuned 330i"? LOL. Had the M340i been available with manual transmission, that would have been my car. My G80 M3 is overkill for me in the horsepower department; 382 HP would've been perfect. The other things I appreciate in the M3 are the availability of full leather and the brakes. Still, I would've gone for a manual M340i in a heartbeat. Enjoy your car!

[wtwo3]

I wouldn't call it either. It isn't a tuned 330i and it also isn't "deserving" of an m badge. People need to understand the "m" badge on these cars is a marketing ploy by bmw.

bavarianride said it's between a 330i and an m3... sort of tongue in cheek... but that's exactly what it is. It shares its suspension with the 330i but the b58 is closer to the s58. It's more or less a progression of the f30 340i and nothing more. Don't be fooled by ///marketing.

[JABCAT]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

I wouldn't call it either. It isn't a tuned 330i and it also isn't "deserving" of an m badge.

Looking at the BMW site, the M340 & the M3 have the same performance (0-60) despite the M3 having 100 hp bump - can someone explain that? Also running through the specs on both cars, I'm not sure what I'd be getting for the extra $18,000 base price? I'm not against paying more money for performance pkgs/options if they actually make it a better car than a lower trim level. I just can't see the huge price difference between these cars?

[Panscan340]

Originally Posted by JABCAT

Looking at the BMW site, the M340 & the M3 have the same performance (0-60) despite the M3 having 100 hp bump - can someone explain that? Also running through the specs on both cars, I'm not sure what I'd be getting for the extra $18,000 base price? I'm not against paying more money for performance pkgs/options if they actually make it a better car than a lower trim level. I just can't see the huge price difference between these cars?

An m3x is like a whole second faster 0-60 than a m340x, not sure what you’re talking about with regards to similar straight line performance . Also m3 way more set up for track. Straight line performance isn’t the only thing that matters, otherwise get a Tesla.
Ofc even a 340 is stupid fast and get you thrown in jail very fast. M3 just gets you thrown in jail faster. But it’s def a faster car both straight line and def on track.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by JABCAT

Looking at the BMW site, the M340 & the M3 have the same performance (0-60) despite the M3 having 100 hp bump - can someone explain that? Also running through the specs on both cars, I'm not sure what I'd be getting for the extra $18,000 base price? I'm not against paying more money for performance pkgs/options if they actually make it a better car than a lower trim level. I just can't see the huge price difference between these cars?

Try turning the steering wheel... difference will be made apparent immediately.




Besides that, 0-60 is a useless metric. It's traction limited, and for many high performance cars we're at a point in time where 60 comes much too quickly to give any meaningful indication of performance. Regardless, you're comparing BMWs quoted times for an automatic awd m340i to a manual rwd m3. Comparing awd to awd the m3 is a good 0.7s quicker on quoted time.

[quizly6]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

I wouldn't call it either. It isn't a tuned 330i and it also isn't "deserving" of an m badge. People need to understand the "m" badge on these cars is a marketing ploy by bmw.

bavarianride said it's between a 330i and an m3... sort of tongue in cheek... but that's exactly what it is. It shares its suspension with the 330i but the b58 is closer to the s58. It's more or less a progression of the f30 340i and nothing more. Don't be fooled by ///marketing.

Yeah, as I said, not truly an M car. However this m340 compared to f30 335/340, or e9x 335, is not very close. There really was a focus on performance and sound as opposed to just making the engine pump out a bit more horsepower IMO.

Still, can not even come close to my g82 m4. Of course marketing did play a role in the branding, but it is still a great drivers experience. IMO I believe it is worthy of being tagged an M performance or M-lite.

[JABCAT]

Originally Posted by Panscan340

An m3x is like a whole second faster 0-60 than a m340x, not sure what you’re talking about with regards to similar straight line performance . Also m3 way more set up for track. Straight line performance isn’t the only thing that matters, otherwise get a Tesla.
Ofc even a 340 is stupid fast and get you thrown in jail very fast. M3 just gets you thrown in jail faster. But it’s def a faster car both straight line and def on track.

It seems only the M3 Competition comes with x drive, and 503 hp (120 more than the M340) so I would expect it to be a a second faster. The Competition version also starts at $24k more than the M340i x-drive. The RWD versions appear to be .3 second difference (so essentially the same). As BMW doesn't seem to list any other performance metrics for either car that's why I asked what do I get for an an additional $18k base price. Just saying it's a faster car or better performing car without giving specifics doesn't answer the question.

Looking at my Z06 with Z07 Ultimate Performance pkg, I know exactly how much better it performs compared to Base Corvette or even a standard Z06 without the Z07 pkg. I can justify the added expense. I'm looking for a specification breakdown to justify the huge price jump to just a base M3 and then another big price jump between the base M3 and the Competition version.

* 1/4 mi times I could find have the standard M3 at 12.2 @ 117 mph & the M340i at 12.3 @ 114 mph. Also found the M340i brakes from 70-0 in 155 ft compared to 160 ft for the M3. Skidpad 1.02g for M3 compared to 0.96g for the M340i.

[RTPenland]

Wow I feel like I've been transported back 3 years with this post

Everyone has an opinion there is no singular truth to this topic so it just ends up in endless debate and then spirals down to people being rude

Just use search if you are actually interested to see if faceless strangers sitting behind a key board agree with you or not

We are better than this people

[Panscan340]

Originally Posted by JABCAT

It seems only the M3 Competition comes with x drive, and 503 hp (120 more than the M340) so I would expect it to be a a second faster. The RWD versions appear to be .3 second difference (so essentially the same). As BMW doesn't seem to list any other performance metrics for either car that's why I asked what do I get for an an additional $18k base price. Just saying it's a faster car or better performing car without giving specifics doesn't answer the question.

Looking at my Z06 with Z07 Ultimate Performance pkg, I know exactly how much better it performs compared to Base Corvette or even a standard Z06 without the Z07 pkg. I can justify the added expense. I'm looking for a specification breakdown to justify the huge price jump to just a base M3 and then another big price jump between the base M3 and the Competition version.

* 1/4 mi times I could find have the standard M3 at 12.2 @ 117 mph & the M340i at 12.3 @ 114 mph. Also found the M340i brakes from 70-0 in 155 ft compared to 160 ft for the M3. Skidpad 1.02g for M3 compared to 0.96g for the M340i.

What exact performance data are you looking for that Chevy provides that bmw doesn’t ? It would largely be similar to a base vette vs z06 kind of discussion. No manufacturer is out there with x ring number or x track for this car vs that really. It would again be quite a bit different on track for a 340 vs m3.

The base m3 is heavily traction limited in terms of 0-60 and somewhat quarter mile but obviously the extra power would help and 60-130 time would be quite a bit less on a base m3 vs 340.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by RTPenland

Wow I feel like I've been transported back 3 years with this post

Everyone has an opinion there is no singular truth to this topic so it just ends up in endless debate and then spirals down to people being rude

Just use search if you are actually interested to see if faceless strangers sitting behind a key board agree with you or not

We are better than this people

It's the gift that keeps on giving.

[JABCAT]

Originally Posted by Panscan340

What exact performance data are you looking for that Chevy provides that bmw doesn’t ? It would largely be similar to a base vette vs z06 kind of discussion. No manufacturer is out there with x ring number or x track for this car vs that really. It would again be quite a bit different on track for a 340 vs m3.

The base m3 is heavily traction limited in terms of 0-60 and somewhat quarter mile but obviously the extra power would help and 60-130 time would be quite a bit less on a base m3 vs 340.

Right, but at least I can find the differences. For example, my Z06 has a completely different engine, different gearing, different suspension, etc. than a Base Corvette. I know that the Z06 with Z07 pkg is 12 seconds faster around Nurburgring than the standard Z06, and I know it's only 3 seconds slower than a ZR1 that has 130 more hp. I know that the Z07-equipped Z06 stops in less distance than the standard Z06 by 15 ft on average. And I know the Z06 with Z07 is about 200 lbs lighter than a Base Corvette.

From everything I can find (not that I'm looking very hard) the M340i & M3 seem pretty evenly matched from a performance standpoint, or close enough as to not justify the huge price jump to the M3 - unless of course I'm missing a bunch of info.

[TheMaxXHD]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

I wouldn't call it either. It isn't a tuned 330i and it also isn't "deserving" of an m badge. People need to understand the "m" badge on these cars is a marketing ploy by bmw.

bavarianride said it's between a 330i and an m3... sort of tongue in cheek... but that's exactly what it is. It shares its suspension with the 330i but the b58 is closer to the s58. It's more or less a progression of the f30 340i and nothing more. Don't be fooled by ///marketing.

I find this funny. Because it begs the question, is the M3 really deserving of the M badge? Like, are we sure? Because, in actual difference, the only way you can justify the difference between the M340i and the M3 is through track use.

The question then becomes, since when did the M badge indicate a car that is only better on the track???

Everyone likes to lament on "new BMW", but "old BMW" M badging didn't used to mean "better than our other cars only on the track".



The point is, even the 330i is a good car. So is the M340i, so is the M3. Who cares about the M marketing. The M340i is the best ROAD 3 series M car. The M3 is the best TRACK 3 series M car. That's the way I see it.

I would not daily drive a stiff M3 chassis on a road with bad MPG (though the M3 can still daily drive if need be), and would definitely prefer the M3 on the track (while the M340i would still be good enough on the track for many, just not AS good)

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by JABCAT

Right, but at least I can find the differences. For example, my Z06 has a completely different engine, different gearing, different suspension, etc. than a Base Corvette. I know that the Z06 with Z07 pkg is 12 seconds faster around Nurburgring than the standard Z06, and I know it's only 3 seconds slower than a ZR1 that has 130 more hp. I know that the Z07-equipped Z06 stops in less distance than the standard Z06 by 15 ft on average. And I know the Z06 with Z07 is about 200 lbs lighter than a Base Corvette.

From everything I can find (not that I'm looking very hard) the M340i & M3 seem pretty evenly matched from a performance standpoint, or close enough as to not justify the huge price jump to the M3 - unless of course I'm missing a bunch of info.

The M3 has a different suspension, different engine, different gearing, etc compared to the m340i. Basically all the things you mentioned for your Z06.

Since you seem to like spreadsheet numbers, here are lap times around Virginia International Raceway:
https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...lightning-lap/
https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...lightning-lap/

The M3c xdrive absolutely demolishes the m340i by 10 seconds on a relatively short track, on the same Pilot Sport 4s tires.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by TheMaxXHD

I find this funny. Because it begs the question, is the M3 really deserving of the M badge? Like, are we sure? Because, in actual difference, the only way you can justify the difference between the M340i and the M3 is through track use.

The question then becomes, since when did the M badge indicate a car that is only better on the track???

Everyone likes to lament on "new BMW", but "old BMW" M badging didn't used to mean "better than our other cars only on the track".



The point is, even the 330i is a good car. So is the M340i, so is the M3. Who cares about the M marketing. The M340i is the best ROAD 3 series M car. The M3 is the best TRACK 3 series M car. That's the way I see it.

I would not daily drive a stiff M3 chassis on a road with bad MPG (though the M3 can still daily drive if need be), and would definitely prefer the M3 on the track (while the M340i would still be good enough on the track for many, just not AS good)

As someone who has extensive time with both, I disagree that the m340i is better on the road. The G80 is not the F80. The suspension setup is significantly more sophisticated in the G80, and is actually much more compliant than the stock m-sport suspension on the m340i. As a result I find the M3 to actually be more comfortable than the m340i.

What's deserving of an "M" badge? I suppose BMW decides that. And we all may define that differently - but you can't argue that the m340i isn't a replacement for the F30 340i with natural progression of ever-improving cars factored in. If you do argue that, then I'm not sure what to tell you The M3 is replacing the M3. The m340i is replacing the 340i. You only have to look up and down BMWs entire lineup to see the same trend.

That's not taking anything away from the m340i, I've had mine for 3 years and have loved it. But the first time I drove the G80 M3 (on the road mind you), it was no contest.

Ultimately I don't care for straight-line stoplight to stoplight spreadsheet numbers. For me it's more about driver engagement while still being practical enough to daily drive and shuttle my kids to/from school. As such I ordered a 6MT G80. My m340i will probably be faster in real world situations, but the engagement and handling of the M3, even on the road, is so far above and beyond what my m340i has offered me over these past 3 years that I had to order one.

[JABCAT]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

The M3 has a different suspension, different engine, different gearing, etc compared to the m340i. Basically all the things you mentioned for your Z06.

Since you seem to like spreadsheet numbers, here are lap times around Virginia International Raceway:
https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...lightning-lap/
https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...lightning-lap/

The M3c xdrive absolutely demolishes the m340i by 10 seconds on a relatively short track, on the same Pilot Sport 4s tires.

Thanks for those links. What are the differences in the engines as they appear basically the same, 3.0L twin power turbo inline 6. Again I would expect the competition version to be quite a bit better on track than the M340. But for the 99% who won't ever see the track, the standard M3 doesn't seem worth it (which can also be said if the Corvette examples) other than to say one has an M3.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by JABCAT

Thanks for those links. What are the differences in the engines as they appear basically the same, 3.0L twin power turbo inline 6. Again I would expect the competition version to be quite a bit better on track than the M340. But for the 99% who won't ever see the track, the standard M3 doesn't seem worth it (which can also be said if the Corvette examples) other than to say one has an M3.

Funny thing is I felt the opposite... I felt the base M3 was worth more to me than the comp xdrive. The base M3 is a 6 speed manual, the competition only comes in automatic. In my super anecdotal experience, people buy the base M3 solely because they want to row their own gears (that's certainly why I ordered mine in base form).

Which is why you can't really compare the times for the base M3 to the m340i. One's a fast shifting automatic, the other is a manual transmission.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by JABCAT

Thanks for those links. What are the differences in the engines as they appear basically the same, 3.0L twin power turbo inline 6. Again I would expect the competition version to be quite a bit better on track than the M340. But for the 99% who won't ever see the track, the standard M3 doesn't seem worth it (which can also be said if the Corvette examples) other than to say one has an M3.

To answer your question regarding the engine:

The S58 (M3) uses twin turbos as opposed to the single twin-scroll turbo in the B58 (m340i). S58 is also slightly smaller displacement (not quite 3.0L), a higher 7,200rpm redline, increased bore, decreased stroke, and larger valves.

Also, I figured this was interesting to look at. I ordered some all-season tires for my M3, and decided to compare them to the m340i tires. My m340i tire in front, M3 tires in the rear. Trust me.... you feel the difference on the road during spirited driving. Where the m340i begins to understeer, the M3 feels like it's on rails.

[RTPenland]

People - buy and drive the car that makes you happy and meets your needs - the badge is now meaningless - just like 90% of LV bags are fake

If your driving wants or needs or ego needs the M3XX buy it (if you can) like it or not prestige cars are a dying breed almost no one cares about your "M" vs a Kia - they are all good - so if you need an M car to hit the track or go fast to grocery store cool...but realize it now or later no one cares. And if you think strangers do (and that is important to you) spend some time and money on therapy to find out why you care. That said if the look back in the parking lot makes you happy - super 100% cool but don't think anyone else cares. I would say this about BMW in general - not just M cars but M owners seem to be a little more sensitive. OOpsie forgot to mention yes I've owned several M cars my favorite my E30 M3 which I only (exceptions) that I took out at night and enjoyed the drive and car

An M car not track driven is a waste - buy it and use it (most don't)

I think most M cars never find their way to the track - it's just stupid - but kudos to BMW for building the car and taking the money. M Car track driven - good for you for you enjoy - M car in the USA with our speed limits never taken to the track? Dumb

[JABCAT]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

To answer your question regarding the engine:

The S58 (M3) uses twin turbos as opposed to the single twin-scroll turbo in the B58 (m340i). S58 is also slightly smaller displacement (not quite 3.0L), a higher 7,200rpm redline, increased bore, decreased stroke, and larger valves.

Also, I figured this was interesting to look at. I ordered some all-season tires for my M3, and decided to compare them to the m340i tires. My m340i tire in front, M3 tires in the rear. Trust me.... you feel the difference on the road during spirited driving. Where the m340i begins to understeer, the M3 feels like it's on rails.
Attachment 3063478

Good info, thanks again