[willougs]

I have an Electric Juice card from my home energy provider (Octopus) which opens up a large(?) network of charging points whilst I'm out and about whose charges can be added direct to my household bill. Well, thats the theory, not used it yet.

Only trouble is, some of the charging points seem expensive, some up to 40p/kWh, so there comes a point where it would be cheaper to use the ICE than to charge the car. I've done some basic maths, however wondering if I've done it correctly and would appreciate if someone could highlight any obvious error.

Working on a lot of "averages", and a full charge getting me about 25 miles:

Mileage: 25 mile(s)
Fuel price used for this calculation: 137 pence per litre
MPG used for this calculation: 40 MPG (adjusted down from optimistic 46)
Total unleaded fuel cost: £3.86
Usable battery capacity estimate of 10.4 kWh

Therefore, £3.86 / 10.4 kWh = £0.37 per kWh is the absolute maximum I should consider paying?

Its a similar story on the BMW Charging app... most of the public charging points on there are around 30p/kWh.

Cant see me using either card too much, although my calculated maximum pence per kWh is getting pretty close to it being worthwhile.

Makes my overnight 5p/kWh at home seem an amazing bargain!

[ramparts]

Originally Posted by willougs

I have an Electric Juice card from my home energy provider (Octopus) which opens up a large(?) network of charging points whilst I'm out and about whose charges can be added direct to my household bill. Well, thats the theory, not used it yet.

Only trouble is, some of the charging points seem expensive, some up to 40p/kWh, so there comes a point where it would be cheaper to use the ICE than to charge the car. I've done some basic maths, however wondering if I've done it correctly and would appreciate if someone could highlight any obvious error.

Working on a lot of "averages", and a full charge getting me about 25 miles:

Mileage: 25 mile(s)
Fuel price used for this calculation: 137 pence per litre
MPG used for this calculation: 46 MPG
Total unleaded fuel cost: £3.36

Therefore, £3.36 / 12 kWh = 0.28p per kWh is the maximum I should consider paying?

Its a similar story on the BMW Charging app... most of the public charging points on there are around 30p/kWh.
Cant see me using either too much.

There's absolutely no way you'll get 46mpg out of 25 miles from cold from the B48. Even if you jumped straight on the motorway, the first 5-10 are sub par as it's warming up.

Factor in town driving and it'll be more like around 35.

[xenon]

Your maths is sound but I agree with David re. the ICE economy. I have a 330i which is essentially the same engine but with less weight and there is no way I’d get 46mpg from cold. In fact, I can’t get anywhere near some of the economy figures bandied about on this forum.

[marksandygill]

I did a trip down to Cornwall from Southampton having forgot to charge, managed to average about 42mpg over the 300 miles, what you have to remember is that even with 0% battery you are still automatically getting charge from regen braking etc so that skews the figures!

[willougs]

Points taken re MPG, but the 330e has the same 2L engine thats in the 320i.

The specs for that say, for xDrive:
5.9 litres/100km (39 mpg) to 6.4 litres/100km (36 mpg)

Its hard to know for sure as the figures quoted in iDrive are always skewed by regen miles etc.

I'll adjust calculations based on 40MPG at best. (as regen miles still valid if car not charged)

Originally Posted by xenon

In fact, I can’t get anywhere near some of the economy figures bandied about on this forum.

If I read the word "witchcraft" one more time....

[xenon]

The 330i also has a 2L engine - they’re all B58.

[willougs]

Originally Posted by xenon

The 330i also has a 2L engine - they’re all B58.

But tuned differently? And therefore MPGs unlikely to be comparable? Power output is much higher.
I was using the MPG data from the 320i as that was a close as I could get to "ICE only" figures, plus a bit for regen.

[4monks]

Originally Posted by xenon

The 330i also has a 2L engine - they’re all B58.

You mean B48. The B58 is the 6 pot 3L turbo.

[xenon]

I did mean B48, yes.

[Mugspence]

For those of us who are not lucky enough to be with Octopus the reality is home charges of 20p kWh.

[paulockenden]

Originally Posted by Mugspence

For those of us who are not lucky enough to be with Octopus the reality is home charges of 20p kWh.

Still cheaper than petrol.

[marksandygill]

Hmm not sure on those battery figures, I have seen claims that the battery is 12kWh but BMW state that it is 11.15kWh, and apparently in the USA only 9kWh is useable but in the UK it is 10.4kWh, not to mention I thought it actually kept 25% back for xtraboost!

I'd suggest going with maybe 10.4kWh instead of 12 for your calculations?

[UnluckySaxon]

Being a notorious tight arse on unnecessary spends and living in London, I mainly charge at free pod-points in Tesco stores or other similar like Asda/Sainsbury partnerships. I shall mention I get to plug in for free at work.

The network Source is an absolute cashcow!! Ridiculous charges.

Instavolt look fairly reasonably priced from what I've seen

[beerglass007]

So glad i have a M340i and dont worry about all this

Just fill up and enjoy

There will be a time when EV comes to my life but I’ll worry about it then and when its more mature

P.S Had my first go in a Tesla 3 AWD and nah the M340i ruined it on every account other than Price Per Mile

Didn’t sound good, didn’t handle as well, wasn’t as fast 0-60 or any other figure. Rattled, build quality lacking not for me right yet

[willougs]

Originally Posted by beerglass007

So glad i have a M340i and dont worry about all this

Just fill up and enjoy

Wouldn't say it is a worry. I can just fill up and enjoy too... but why not try to make that as cheap as possible?

M340i quicker 0-60 than a Tesla 3 Dual Motor? You sure?

[Charlie (Wessex)]

Model 3 Performance.... have you seen the cost? Put a £10k deposit down and 10k miles a year for 48 months, you're paying £838 PCP. HP would be £1300 a month.

If you can run it through a business, then it might make more sense.

[willougs]

Originally Posted by Charlie (Wessex)

Model 3 Performance.... have you seen the cost? Put a £10k deposit down and 10k miles a year for 48 months, you're paying £838 PCP. HP would be £1300 a month.

If you can run it through a business, then it might make more sense.

I wasn't questioning the cost, nor suggesting I would even consider buying one. I was querying whether the M340i really does "ruin" the Model 3 Dual Motor on 0-60.

Anyway, it's off topic. Once again another thread has turned into "you must be stupid to consider buying anything other than an M340"

[paulockenden]

Originally Posted by willougs

Once again another thread has turned into…

Makes a nice change from the rants against the EU!

[marksandygill]

If it weren't for the EU the M340i would beat the Model 3 and you could do it without a seatbelt...

[Charlie (Wessex)]

The one thing that people in electric cars seem to ignore, is that the tax situation isn't going to stay the same for that much longer. Yes, running costs are cheap now, but with the treasury facing ever increasing shortfalls to their £40bn revenue as more people move to non-ICE, road pricing will come in.

I suspect as the carrots to move to EVs disappears, the stick might well be fuel duty on top of road pricing, so those in ICEs will face a double whammy.

[xenon]

Whatever the costs the Model 3 Performance would muller an M340i 0-60. I'd rather have an M340i but if you're going to make claims....

[Charlie (Wessex)]

Quite like the idea of a Hyundai Ioniq 5N which I think will hit 60 in 3.5secs

Anyway - claims. I do see that Tesla claim lots of savings based on today's taxation. They'll rather be affected if road pricing comes in.

Interesting point I heard on the radio this week - charging etiquette. If you have a limited number of charging points in a street, say 2 for 10 cars, how do you organise when you charge? Do you leave it on charge and go to bed, blocking it off for anyone else? Of course, if you have your own drive, then that's an issue. I always wonder what happens on the motorway when you have dozens of cars waiting to use the charging spots. Do you limit things to 20 minutes so everyone gets to top up?

But I can't see electric being the future. It's OK now, but if we all move to EVs is their going to be enough materials to build them all. There's something like 75-80m new cars sold each year....that's a lot of lithium, cobalt and nickel.

Can't help but think the future relies on cheap energy that can go to power hydrogen production.