[bpu]

With the 2021 S Class we now have MB and Audi going all in on dual or tall touch screens being the only method of input in the vehicle. Both brands have abandoned central rotary dials and most hard buttons for things like volume, track, temp, even drive modes. I think BMW nailed it in their current cockpits - you get a big touchscreen if you want it but also all the normal controls for temp, radio, iDrive, and the combination is perfect. You can use the touchscreen at a stop light if you wish but the hard controls are so much easier to use while driving.

My question, how do we convince BMW that this is a big differentiator for them and they should stick with it? I think superior ergonomics and ease of use has always been a highlight of theirs and it'd be terrible if they abandoned this setup and copied the other brands. Once every car just has a giant touchscreen inside there is very little to set them apart or make them feel special. So far everything they've released has been very good, but these 2 Series Active Tourer spy shots indicate they are toying with that direction as well.

[ThatKrazyPolak]

I find the whole "iPad in a car" thing ridiculous.

[upsidedownfunnel]

Nothing you can do. The majority of people buying these cars want to be wowed in the showroom and show off how cool their car looks to their friends. That's what sells cars. Actual ergonomics and driving dynamics? Who cares?

[giorgoXXI]

I agree BMW have nailed it in terms of user input. There is touch, buttons, iDrive controller, voice, gestures and even drawing!

I actually rarely use the touchscreen apart from when I need to type something on the keyboard. While driving the iDrive controller is brilliant, I would hate it if BMW went all touch. It is incredibly distracting and I don't get how, for safety reasons, there are laws that forbid the usage of mobile phones yet using a "tablet" is absolutely fine.

[stein_325i]

We can't stop them. In the modern world, luxury now is synonymous with technology.

[Burrcold]

Originally Posted by jstein55

We can't stop them. In the modern world, luxury now is synonymous with technology.

The problem with this is that luxury is not going to be synonymous with technology/screens for very long since every modern car will have a giant slab screen controlling everything. So what are the luxury brands going to do to set them apart? Before it used to be dash design, and leather flowing around the gauge hood and center stack, higher quality switchgear and hvac controls. I guess now it will be like smart phones...the higher priced brands get smaller bezels and more snappy touch response, higher resolution screens etc. I don't know...this all makes me sad that this is what the differentiating attributes will be

[VetteGuy]

I agree, driving pleasure is getting lost in the technology. BMW has one of, if not the best mixes of touch technology and tactile controls, and relatively ergonomically laid out. Not too much I would change in that respect.

One of the things I really like about the Cockpit pro layout in the new models is the control screen placement lower on the dash so it’s not in my line or vision when driving.

And... I don’t want any autonomous features! Only ordering Parking Assist Package for the great surround cameras.

Great job BMW!

[loonysup]

My wife has a Hyundai Pallisade Limited that only has a touch screen and it drives me nuts. For me, it's too much of a reach and I prefer to have an iDrive type controller right at my fingertips.

I love the car otherwise and she is absolutely in love with it so I guess that's all that matters.

[bpu]

Originally Posted by jstein55

We can't stop them. In the modern world, luxury now is synonymous with technology.

As Burrcold said, the problem with this line of thinking is that there is nothing all that impressive or high tech about a touchscreen. We've had them in our handheld phones for at least 13 years and they're everywhere else as well. I expect luxury cars to push the envelope on technology, but putting a bit flat screen in the middle is not high tech or innovative. And you lose a lot of ability to create a differentiated and premium-feeling cabin.

Originally Posted by upsidedownfunnel

Nothing you can do. The majority of people buying these cars want to be wowed in the showroom and show off how cool their car looks to their friends. That's what sells cars. Actual ergonomics and driving dynamics? Who cares?

What is "wow"ing about a big touchscreen though?

[NYC_340i]

I prefer a controller knob over a touchscreen. Trying to touch the screen while driving especially on bad roads is a nightmare and dangerous. I like that with a controller knob you can keep your hand on it and use the system with no issues.
On top of that having a screen with a bunch of fingerprints on it drives me crazy.

I really like what BMW did which is to give the user options to use the system however they like. I didn't mind that BMW made the newer cars touchscreen because of them continuing to include the iDrive knob. Between the physical knob, touchscreen and even gesture control and voice control which can be gimmicky, I think BMW nailed this. I feel that they perfectly designed iDrive to work using a traditional controller and with touch and it'll be great it that stays the trend.

[EXE46]

I have taken solace with the fact that eventually I'll just stop buying new cars and secure two forever cars. Something like a next gen M2C and a Toyota forerunner or Landcruiser are the main contenders I have been contemplating. I know the Toyota will last a lifetime.

[upsidedownfunnel]

Originally Posted by loonysup

My wife has a Hyundai Pallisade Limited that only has a touch screen and it drives me nuts. For me, it's too much of a reach and I prefer to have an iDrive type controller right at my fingertips.

I love the car otherwise and she is absolutely in love with it so I guess that's all that matters.

Yeah but things like climate control, basic media controls, seat heaters/coolers, and top level menu options all have well placed real buttons. That's honestly not that bad. 95% of things you have to do when driving or at a stoplight can be done with hard buttons. You can control basic media functions from hard buttons on the steering wheel and the dash. The S class is doing away with pretty much all buttons. IMO, those are two very different things.

[gofast182]

You can reach out to BMW corporate and let them know. Make sure you're buying BMW. Make it known to friends/coworkers the pitfalls of touch screens and the advantage of BMW. Comment on social media posts and reviews of cars. Those are the main things you can do.

I think BMW knows this. When they released the new interior concept with iDrive 7 (including buttons) on the G05 they did it with intentions of it being a corporate design scheme and having it last through the current model cycle of new vehicles, at least 5-6 years into the future.

Our personal experience; we bought a G05 a couple years ago but before that my wife was sure she wanted a Velar. After driving the Velar, among other things, we didn't like how you had to look down at the touch screen to make sure you're getting the right function and how some functions were in sub-menus which compounded the problem. One of the things we loved about the G05 is that it gives you multiple (often redundant) options for controlling the car: touch screen, iDrive controller, hard buttons, steering wheel controls, voice control, gestures.

[StevenDS85]

I almost never touching the touchscreen. iDrive wheel works great and the screen itself doesn’t show finger prints. It’s also much more convenient to sit back and operate the iDrive wheel instead of stretching your arm and try to push the right position on the schreen ... oops, another bump in the road ...

[Burrcold]

Originally Posted by StevenDS85

I almost never touching the touchscreen. iDrive wheel works great and the screen itself doesn’t show finger prints. It’s also much more convenient to sit back and operate the iDrive wheel instead of stretching your arm and try to push the right position on the schreen ... oops, another bump in the road ...

I never use the touchscreen either. I mostly use the iDrive controller, but have also started using more of the voice instructions. I don't mind if it takes an extra second to register to command, if it means I don't have to take my hands off the wheel at all.

[SteveinArizona]

I think BMW has done it right with my 2018 530e. Buttons and switches for those things I might want to modify while driving, infotainment screen for everything else.

I find that I use the volume switch a lot but I could make do with the control on the steering wheel if they took that away. But I would want/demand at least one or the other.

Same for the AC. I live in hot Arizona and after a trip to a store for a half hour the car can get hot. I like to turn it on max for a few minues and then turn it back to auto. I do not want to nor am I willing to take my eyes off the road to use a touchscreen and a series of menu items while driving!

It does look like most manufacturers are moving in the direction of a single large tablet to control everything. I hope BMW doesn't go that way and, if it does, I hope that there will be someone left who doesn't.

[TheBingoBalls]

The only thing we can really hope for is that BMW keeps touchscreen as a secondary input like they currently. But I think that's only going to last so long before they go full touchscreen - wasn't there a leak of a vehicle without the iDrive knob?

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

The only thing we can really hope for is that BMW keeps touchscreen as a secondary input like they currently. But I think that's only going to last so long before they go full touchscreen - wasn't there a leak of a vehicle without the iDrive knob?

Yep, the 2-series Active Tourer was spied with a touchscreen and no iDrive knob.

[BMW11]

I hope that they do not get rid of the physical buttons and knobs either. I don't understand why these manufacturers do not notice that fiddling with changing settings in multiple menus and sub-menus while driving is not safe... How do they not notice this when they design a car? Isn't it against the law to text and drive on a phone (in NYC it is) but car manufacturers feel its ok to go through menus and sub-menus searching to change stuff and take your eyes off the road. if they make touch screen adjustments while driving also against the law then maybe the car manufacturers will change their tune and keep the knobs

[TheDudeMan]

One clear message is not to buy their product. However, that would be very difficult since everyone is going that route.

In my 330i, I do have the virtual cockpit and it's cool - more a novelty. I would love to see an amazing analog dash. Think Rolex, simple, but elegant. I don't care for the apple watch.

[SteveinArizona]

Originally Posted by BMW11

I hope that they do not get rid of the physical buttons and knobs either. I don't understand why these manufacturers do not notice that fiddling with changing settings in multiple menus and sub-menus while driving is not safe... How do they not notice this when they design a car? Isn't it against the law to text and drive on a phone (in NYC it is) but car manufacturers feel its ok to go through menus and sub-menus searching to change stuff and take your eyes off the road. if they make touch screen adjustments while driving also against the law then maybe the car manufacturers will change their tune and keep the knobs

cost, cost, cost. It is cheaper to put everything on a tablet. The car companies hope that by using a massive tablet, customers won't realize that they have taken away critical functionality.

[NorCalAthlete]

Goes against the entire design theory of trying to keep your eyes on the road. I don't mind multifunction displays, but give me analog controls and gauges for key functions.