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      06-18-2019, 10:12 PM   #67
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Someone say ///M1?

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      06-18-2019, 10:24 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brake_Late View Post
🚆 predicting a #bmwturbopower 4 or 6 banger ( please make it a P48 derivative 🙏🏼 )
I agree that, if they are building a case for a PHEV rather than an EV, a P48 actually makes good sense. It would fit the i8 platform without the need to modify any hard points. Even if they had to detune it from race spec, it could still give them, say, 500hp from the combustion part of the drivetrain alone. And they could, for example, double that by complementing it with two or even three electric motors.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ron_jeremy View Post
Pointless, ice is on it's final straw, stop wasting time and resources and let's build a EV division, the i3 was a good start, everything since then have been a waste of time!
An EV division? If the ICE is as dead as you say, then so are EV divisions. Why have a division for something that should soon be the entirety of your business? Every BMW will soon be electrified and M Division products certainly won't be left out. In fact, I would argue this supercar exercise makes sense only if it is at the very least a plug-in hybrid.
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      06-18-2019, 11:23 PM   #69
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I pray the car would be a GT car. Something with the focus being simple.....

1-Small (1M or early 3 series size up to e46 max)
2-Balanced (maybe even mid-engine).
3-2 doors
4-S65 V2
5-All wheel drive w/rear only mode by button.
6-Carbon monocoque as well as all exterior panels.
7-DCT

IMO this utilized basic features BMW has been practicing but steps up their execution to the extent I expressed above.
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      06-19-2019, 12:11 AM   #70
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I don't know if anyone remembers this but maybe it could be McLaren + BMW in the same way the Supra and Z4 exist?

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/n...ine-technology
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      06-19-2019, 12:52 AM   #71
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If you told me this in 2010 I would have believed it.

in 2019 BMW strikes me as a brand that is long gone. I don't think they have it in them.
this. they are done making unique cars.
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      06-19-2019, 03:06 AM   #72
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Why all the replies saying BMW won't do it? I highly disagree. BMW sees the success of the MB Amg gt and know they can do it better In all aspects. So why not do it? There would be a big market I guarantee it. Not only would a large % of M/// owners purchase one but if they could steal a small fraction of the amg gt sales (and they will if they go through with it) they would be comfortably in the green.

Not to mention that but it would be nothing short of amazing. Having the freedom to start from scratch instead of being handcuffed by a cars body that they didn't design.. Now of course it's not a huge handcuff with BMW's being what they are but still, think of the possibility. All I can say is I HOPE they follow through with it.
I highly doubt it will be innovative.

AMG GT is nothing short of engineering marvel with, but not limited to, its transaxle Getrag DCT, carbon fiber driveshaft, nano coated cylinder heads that boost power efficiency. Car's got an incredible traction despite being RWD layout with 500+ hp.

All these things M division could have integrated into M8 and make it better but they decided instead to go with a same S63 engine, same ZFat, and an inherently heavy AWD with a few more button gimmicks. Backseat is also unusable for M8 unlike its predecessor.

It is the same reason why I have mixed feelings towards the M2. It is arguably the most engaging drive that the class has to offer, but nothing it has done hasn't been done prior to the reincarnation of "driving pleasure". When comparing the upcoming M2 CS to 2014 base M4, one could argue that the latter is more potent in all aspects bar the shorter wheelbase. Now BMW seems like they are trying to force everyone who enjoys driving to only get the M2 variants.

From 2015 BMW M loves to copy and paste and keep cost down to minimum. It produces nothing that touches the heart of enthusiasts.
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      06-19-2019, 05:20 AM   #73
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Just a new Z4M will do, thx
With a stick please.
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      06-19-2019, 07:16 AM   #74
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If BMW indeed finally releases the long-awaited distant successor to the emblematic M1 supercar, it will certainly have 'M' in its name + likely a number to stay consistent with the M range nomenclature (I doubt they'd go with just 'M Coupé' as that wouldn't set it clearly on top of the M range hierarchy and incidentally would also evoke the Z3 M Coupé) ➡ M10 seems like the perfect choice:
  • It obviously can't be M1 once again, as that would now make it appear as inferior to the whole M range (M2 to M8) that's been swarming ever since. So it needs to be a higher number than 8.
  • But not M9, because, who knows, maybe BMW will some day want to release a 9 Series super luxury sedan, and most importantly, because this supercar would now be the first modern standalone M model not based on any preexisting series model and it would make sense to break apart from the one-digit traditional mold by climbing to 10.

If this M10 becomes reality, then BMW will also conveniently be able to release a 1er hatch M to battle the A45 and RS3 and actually name it M1 for range consistency reasons. Who will realistically blame them for reusing the iconic M1 moniker on a hot hatch now that there would actually finally be a successor to the original M1 supercar named M10?

Last edited by advantage20; 06-19-2019 at 08:56 AM..
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      06-19-2019, 08:37 AM   #75
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I wonder where it will end up...

And what kind of doors should it have ?
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      06-19-2019, 08:52 AM   #76
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In some places ... the 50y celebration has already begun...

https://50.bmwhk.com/Joy_Is_Timeless/en/Legacy/
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      06-19-2019, 10:57 AM   #77
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I think most here have forgotten, or have NEVER known that the M1 was a financial disaster of epic proportions and wasn't even allowed to race in the series it was designed for.

It is only with the passage of time and the limited availability that the M1 has garnered the legendary status it has now. And the culmination of a set of conditions that created a near perfect storm for it to exist.

1. It took an iron will and a insatiable desire to compete from the division head, Jochen Neerpasch. Someone whom racing and motorsport runs in their blood, and a drive, no pun intended, to see a project through no matter the obstacles. The project was initially suppose to go to Lamborghini for production and assembly, but during that time Lamborghini was in dire financial straits and weren't able to even built 400 cars to meet homologation rules. Mountains had to be cleared, and a thousand different threads crossed to get 400 cars built for public consumption in order for the car to be legal to go up agains the mighty Porsche in racing. The body had to be assembled elsewhere, shipped across the continent to mate with the frame and chassis, while engine, transmission, and a slew of other components were all built and designed nearly from scratch.

I'm afraid there's no one at BMW right now, nor its foreseeable future, that can possibly pull of a stunt like this. It's too much a corporation and not enough a small car manufacturer with no f**ks given and one goal in mind. Beat Porsche.

2. Homologation. Sounds dirty. And it is. The M1 was built specifically so BMW can pit a mid-engine supercar in FIA's Series 5 group, up against the dominating Porsche of the time. At the end of the day, due to the snafu with the Lamborghini partnership, not enough cars were built in time to even compete in the series, but HOMOLOGATION was the reason why the M1 exist. So was the reason for the mighty E30 M3.

That requirement no longer exist today. There's no longer a drive to build an x amount of cars for racing rules. The number of cars built and the reason for them to exist is now purely financial, as in revenue driven. Only 5xx S54 Z3 M Coupes built? Not because racing, but because they didn't think anyone would buy it. Only 8xx 1M Coupes built? Because they think after that, no one would buy it.

3. It's a revenue driven company now. There's no financial and revenue sense to build a car like the M1 today. Imagine having to do all that, throw tons of R&D money into it, cost for tooling for unique chassis, engine, and possibly body stamping and component parts, only to build 400 cars, and because it's so few of them built, you'd have to charge exorbitant $$$ for them, and no one bought it because the racing series you're suppose to compete in won't even let you race them so you'd have to spend your own $$$ to create a racing series of your OWN.

Imagine the $$$ involved then, translated to the inflated cost NOW. You're probably looking at billions needed to be invested, only to sell what, about 500 cars that can potentially justify a marketing cost of about $300K?

The bean counters would sh*t bricks.

It's a different time and different company now. Imagine BMW engineers having to go behind the Corporate backs and work secretly at night in off hours to create a hoot of a car based off of their new roadster chassis, and that was how the Z3 Coupe was born back in the late 90s. 20 years ago.

THEY HAD TO SECRETLY BUILT THE PROTOTYPE. Because they know corporate won't approve it.

Fast forward 20 years, we're now at a point where BMW is purely a profit driven company. Do you all think the same engineers that spent their nights dreaming up and fabricating the Z3 Coupe is going to be able to successfully pitch a new bespoke chassis, engine, components...etc to the brass and still have a job tomorrow?

I doubt it.

The likelihood that this is more than just an R&D exercise and will eventually see real production is about as good as me winning an F1 racing seat. And I'm not even dreaming of the driver's championship.

The days at BMW of building something like the M1 is long, LONG gone. Compared to what made BMW BMW, it is but a shell of its former self. Snowball has a better chance in hell IMO.
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Last edited by The HACK; 06-19-2019 at 11:30 AM..
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      06-19-2019, 04:56 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsrbri View Post
M1 redux. Done

V-8 turbo w/hybrid. 800 hp. Nurburgring sub 6:50
Coincidence that BMW discontinued their M8 Racing program, and cited Formula E, yet there is a hypercar class which Aston Martin, Toyota, and apparently AMG will be competitors in?
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      06-19-2019, 10:46 PM   #79
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Engineers Not Accountants

Jason my dear fellow BMW enthusiast, I share your hope that something amazing could be in the works but under current BMW leadership I fear that the priority and belief in such projects only goes as far as concept stage.

How many cars have we seen displayed that have been relegated to the BMW museum display?

We need a Reitlze or Von Kuenheim (or dare i say it Dr. Z form Benz) type of individual at the helm to see such projects through and sadly that kind of daring and bold thinking is replaced with a corporate culture that lives by the books and not by product substance.

Yes the business case is always important but brand and what it stands for always wins in the long run in my books.

Look at what the M1 and original M3 did for BMW and how much it still sells cars years after.

Last edited by N & M; 06-24-2019 at 07:42 AM..
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      06-20-2019, 10:00 PM   #80
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      06-21-2019, 11:22 PM   #81
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im guessing some sort of 2 door SUV supercar
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      06-22-2019, 11:51 PM   #82
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Quote:
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Not gonna happen
I mean this is an Audi guy now. He used to have an R8.
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      06-23-2019, 05:11 AM   #83
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I think most here have forgotten, or have NEVER known that the M1 was a financial disaster of epic proportions and wasn't even allowed to race in the series it was designed for.

...
Very well said. Clearly someone who knows something about the history.
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      06-23-2019, 08:43 AM   #84
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2mins in... " "





Dream Big , think 50years, a Golden Point in their timeline , think expensive, think 🦄

HK already is already ready:

https://50.bmwhk.com/Joy_Is_Timeless/en/Legacy/
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      06-23-2019, 07:35 PM   #85
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Looking forward to that 50 year anniversary pure M crossover activity vehicle. Pure FWD and Auto greatness headed our way.

If they build that they then might have the money for a Z4M....
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      06-23-2019, 09:28 PM   #86
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2mins in... " "





Dream Big , think 50years, a Golden Point in their timeline , think expensive, think 🦄

HK already is already ready:

https://50.bmwhk.com/Joy_Is_Timeless/en/Legacy/
LOL is that an official BMW site posting photos of modified Z3s and E30 M3s that are stanced? Pretty silly really...
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      06-23-2019, 09:58 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drv4fun View Post
Looks like no one remembers the Z8. So why not build a special limited run car. Whatever it is it will sell out and never drop in value.
Technically the z8 was still based on an e39 5 series chassis.
TBH I can't see bmw develop a bespoke chassis for a sportscar like mercedes has done with goodies like a transaxle gearbox etc in the SLS and AMG GT.

With BMW......it'll always be a partscar. They may disguise it as a 'new model' to fool the technically less educated, but one look underneath and the heritage shows if you know your bmw's.
If just the body and interior is new but suspension/drivetrain or engine isn't, it's not a 'new car' imho.
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      06-24-2019, 07:29 AM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GuidoK View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drv4fun View Post
Looks like no one remembers the Z8. So why not build a special limited run car. Whatever it is it will sell out and never drop in value.
Technically the z8 was still based on an e39 5 series chassis.
TBH I can't see bmw develop a bespoke chassis for a sportscar like mercedes has done with goodies like a transaxle gearbox etc in the SLS and AMG GT.

With BMW......it'll always be a partscar. They may disguise it as a 'new model' to fool the technically less educated, but one look underneath and the heritage shows if you know your bmw's.
If just the body and interior is new but suspension/drivetrain or engine isn't, it's not a 'new car' imho.
As far as I know the Z8 used E39 M5 engine, Powertrain, and suspension components but not the chassis. The Z8 had an all aluminum chassis not the same as the E39 M5.
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