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      05-26-2019, 04:21 PM   #23
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I think if they followed the popular opinion that the F80 looked great and MAJORITY of people loved it.
The majority loved the E39 and initially hated the E60. Everyone gasped at the X7 as if BMW had lost their mind...
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      05-26-2019, 04:28 PM   #24
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the reliability of forced induction has leveled the playing field too much.
I think the f80 will be my first last "current generation bmw"
the grills are hideous---but the standard f series without an m-sport package is pretty ugly too. so likely the g80 will look nice.
I only drive the m3 because of the stick shift.
c63 spanks the m3 if you dont track it. (no stick)
m3 looks better...timeless design.
i guess bmw looked at the opportunity cost of not whoring out their brand and through shareholder pressure said fuck it...we have to have something to compete with the accords and cr-vs. I see little difference in a bmw x1,x2, then a mazada cx-3. then some genius goes hey I can save another nickel lets make this cheap plastic dashboard and use it on all platforms. All manfuactuers have gone this route. Jags are essentially dressed up pigs. The f-type I drove was dull.
Brands used to stand for something...they still do; but now its how can we use our reputation to squeeze out every penny so us stockholder can profit. nothing wrong with that. your ass gets the boot if you don't continue to innovate.

lastly; society is very vain. everyone wants to drive a bmw or whatever. I guess thats how branding works in its essence. everyone wants to be special and unique.
"you got the 4 sereis" HA "I got the GRAN coupe" You got an f80. i got the zcp...i got the jahare...gts...cs...jon voight drove this car!!!

its a difficult concept for car enthusiasts to wrap their minds around, because to some their cars are like the 5k channel bags women walk around with.

anyways. you can always buy a older generation BMW. i want the s85 or s65...throw about 5k for someone to bring it to tip top order, and have it as my fun car. def going to try to get some track experience this fall so I can really stretch her legs.
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      05-26-2019, 04:37 PM   #25
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I think if BMW gave the same design language the current M5 has, and put that in an M3 it would be a winner. But yet, BMW has to live up to the grille memes going around and make it reality.
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      05-26-2019, 04:48 PM   #26
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it was this very sentiment around the new M3 that solidified my decision to go F80

Love the aggressive styling of F80 and especially those rear quarter panels
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      05-26-2019, 04:48 PM   #27
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If not bmw then where do you turn? It's not like the other German brands have viable alternatives to the m3 if you prioritize driving feel/fun over comfort and luxury. And if you want a stick there is literally nothing else in the segment unless you pony up for a Porsche.

As for bmw not listening, I don't see it that way at all. In fact, it seems like the complete opposite. The single biggest complaint about the f80 has been lack of traction for which bmw will now be offering awd. Another huge complaint is centered around the DCT which people complain isn't smooth and has odd tendencies in day to day living. They are now going with a traditional automatic which should be much smoother and more livable. Also, they seem dead set on still offering a manual transmission for those die hard fans.

So what exactly are they not doing that you think they should be? Or is this the case of the grass isn't always greener.
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      05-26-2019, 04:51 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by gatorfast View Post
If not bmw then where do you turn? It's not like the other German brands have viable alternatives to the m3 if you prioritize driving feel/fun over comfort and luxury. And if you want a stick there is literally nothing else in the segment unless you pony up for a Porsche.

As for bmw not listening, I don't see it that way at all. In fact, it seems like the complete opposite. The single biggest complaint about the f80 has been lack of traction for which bmw will now be offering awd. Another huge complaint is centered around the DCT which people complain isn't smooth and has odd tendencies in day to day living. They are now going with a traditional automatic which should be much smoother and more livable. Also, they seem dead set on still offering a manual transmission for those die hard fans.

So what exactly are they not doing that you think they should be? Or is this the case of the grass isn't always greener.
The design language being debated on the new G80 is beyond hideous. Hell, I'd like them to build off the M340i and give it the proper M treatment. Not making the thing look like a large mouth bass.
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      05-26-2019, 04:52 PM   #29
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M5 comp slushbox is excellent and shifts as fast if not faster than a DCT. Even the downshift from 2-1 is smooth now. Only subjective downside is the lack of the larger DCT style shift paddles and the F90 will roll forward off the brake like a regular automatic now. Hands down would get an F90 over those two benz choices even a non comp ;-)
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      05-26-2019, 04:53 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Jbmw98 View Post
The design language being debated on the new G80 is beyond hideous. Hell, I'd like them to build off the M340i and give it the proper M treatment. Not making the thing look like a large mouth bass.
Considering we don't know what it looks like yet, I would say let's wait and see.
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      05-26-2019, 04:57 PM   #31
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Considering we don't know what it looks like yet, I would say let's wait and see.
https://g20.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1607531

This is where my sentiment is coming from. The OP is confirmed to work at BMW and has called a lot of things correct on prior models.
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      05-26-2019, 05:02 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jbmw98 View Post
https://g20.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1607531

This is where my sentiment is coming from. The OP is confirmed to work at BMW and has called a lot of things correct on prior models.
Still don't know what it will look like exactly. I'll reserve judgment until I see it.

But looks are subjective. Is that your only quibble with bmw?
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      05-26-2019, 05:46 PM   #33
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I am not opposed to BMW, actually I love BMW over any other brand, I just really wish they would put in some more effort. Now, the only way I'd accept the new design is if the new M3 was looking like the hommage R concept
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      05-26-2019, 06:00 PM   #34
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Find myself "needing" a dual purpose car again. Something for family/wife duty and occasional track.

Have a GTS so modded F80 doesn't appeal.

Looked around, found nothing that would substitute. Considered re-modifying my E90.

Thinking now might just wait for the G80.

Point is, M3 is and will continue to be the answer to this all purpose dilemma. No other car does it as well historically, and highly unlikely any sedan will be a match for the G80. (Although my take is C63 S came close this last time around, including track.)

If you're talking street driving only and styling (subjective), then sure, there are plenty of competitors. You should test everything.
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      05-26-2019, 08:52 PM   #35
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If you can stomach the Benz ergonomics, interior and exterior design, heck everything awkward looking and feeling that make it a Benz they make stellar FI engines and a V8 to boot. Personally EVERYTHING about a Benz feels and looks wrong to me, can’t stand them, except the engines. The only one I would consider is the G Klasse but now a days it’s as cliche’ as a Rolex.

Last edited by solstice; 05-26-2019 at 08:57 PM..
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      05-26-2019, 10:24 PM   #36
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Mercedes are for grandma's and grandpa's. Period!
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      05-28-2019, 12:48 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jbmw98 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
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Originally Posted by Jbmw98 View Post
See, and I dont mind the new styling on SUV's but I do mind it on such an iconic car like the M3. I just really hope BMW takes the design language in an M5 and transfers that to the new M3.
You see, I think the 5 looks classy and very boring. It's a safe and lazy update which is ok for an executive sedan like the M5. I'm very excited that it seems the M3 isn't going down the same route and that we instead could get something very fresh and very different. That's the problem with designs, it's very subjective and it's impossible for BMW to follow everyone's wishes.
I think if they followed the popular opinion that the F80 looked great and MAJORITY of people loved it.
Are you sure about that? Go back and read some of the initial opinions of the f80 when it was first unveiled. I remember reading a lot of comments about how it was a big bloated boat with an engine based on the n55, an engine used in the regular product line. Everyone said it was too big, too plain, not a "real M-car", not special enough, blah blah blah. With time the criticisms quieted to a dull roar, and eventually it became a favorite, like every other generation of m3 before it. In a few years it'll be referred to as a classic. Now the g80 will start the entire cycle again.
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      05-28-2019, 07:52 AM   #38
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There are plenty of DCTs out there that can handle higher amounts of HP/TQ. Porsche, Lamborghini and Ferrari are all using them. BMW wants to cut costs so they can make Electric Toyotas with Roundel's on the hood. Wait they are already doing that :

Using a ZF8 in an ///M car is a travesty. It might work for the Land Yacht M5 crowd but won't work out to well for BMW in the M2/3/4 models.

The ZF work fine in the M235 Factory Racer.
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      06-01-2019, 04:44 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jbmw98 View Post
I have recently been looking at getting an M3 Comp/CS or an M5 Comp. I've even waited to see what the M8 GC will look like. But, at the end of the day I always come back to the M3. For me, it's the crown jewel of BMW and the M division.

I have been reading the discussions about the design of the G80 M3. I hate saying this, because I've always been a diehard BMW fan, but times change, and I don't think BMW is listening to customers. I feel I'm not alone in this camp.

This has caused me to start looking at Mercedes - either the C63S or E63S. It seems Mercedes actually listens to its customers in terms of design and popular demand.

How many of you are planning on jumping ship if the next M3 doesnt fair well?
Thought about it... considering that the C63 is aging quite a bit, is a bit pricier with historically poor financing/lease rates it keeps me from strongly considering it....

The beautiful sound of the AMG does make me consider the E63S Wagon or a C63S. For me I'm waiting to move and depending on how close I am to a track, I will lean towards/away from certain things.

I'm honestly also considering a 992 with massively compromised back seat because they're so sexy. Eternal dilemma. I'm someone who will cross shop a 718 GTS and Ford Raptor, so I make it especially hard on myself lol.
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      06-01-2019, 04:45 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jbmw98 View Post
I have recently been looking at getting an M3 Comp/CS or an M5 Comp. I've even waited to see what the M8 GC will look like. But, at the end of the day I always come back to the M3. For me, it's the crown jewel of BMW and the M division.

I have been reading the discussions about the design of the G80 M3. I hate saying this, because I've always been a diehard BMW fan, but times change, and I don't think BMW is listening to customers. I feel I'm not alone in this camp.

This has caused me to start looking at Mercedes - either the C63S or E63S. It seems Mercedes actually listens to its customers in terms of design and popular demand.

How many of you are planning on jumping ship if the next M3 doesnt fair well?
Thought about it... considering that the C63 is aging quite a bit, is a bit pricier with historically poor financing/lease rates it keeps me from strongly considering it....

The beautiful sound of the AMG does make me consider the E63S Wagon or a C63S. For me I'm waiting to move and depending on how close I am to a track, I will lean towards/away from certain things.

I'm honestly also considering a 992 with massively compromised back seat because they're so sexy. Eternal dilemma. I'm someone who will cross shop a 718 GTS and Ford Raptor, so I make it especially hard on myself lol.
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      06-02-2019, 11:14 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jbmw98 View Post
I have recently been looking at getting an M3 Comp/CS or an M5 Comp. I've even waited to see what the M8 GC will look like. But, at the end of the day I always come back to the M3. For me, it's the crown jewel of BMW and the M division.

I have been reading the discussions about the design of the G80 M3. I hate saying this, because I've always been a diehard BMW fan, but times change, and I don't think BMW is listening to customers. I feel I'm not alone in this camp.

This has caused me to start looking at Mercedes - either the C63S or E63S. It seems Mercedes actually listens to its customers in terms of design and popular demand.

How many of you are planning on jumping ship if the next M3 doesnt fair well?
Thought about it... considering that the C63 is aging quite a bit, is a bit pricier with historically poor financing/lease rates it keeps me from strongly considering it....

The beautiful sound of the AMG does make me consider the E63S Wagon or a C63S. For me I'm waiting to move and depending on how close I am to a track, I will lean towards/away from certain things.

I'm honestly also considering a 992 with massively compromised back seat because they're so sexy. Eternal dilemma. I'm someone who will cross shop a 718 GTS and Ford Raptor, so I make it especially hard on myself lol.
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      06-04-2019, 07:05 AM   #42
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I’m sure they read the forums, however, we make up a small percentage of the total audience, worldwide. Also don’t forget that BMW is a publicly traded company so stock earnings are heavily factored in, which mean sales. I don’t think the large grills that are floating around will be actual production design.

Not sure your point on #2. ZF makes the DCT transmission. The last I read was that the DCT wasn’t able to reliably handle the torque and power of the new power plants so they were moving to a new platform from ZF.

The F8X style is dated. Like it or not. It’s the same argument people have with E36, E46, E9X etc. I’m sure it’ll be a hot minute for people to adjust to the new style, but will win many over.
The F8X doesn't look that dated next to BMW's newest offerings.
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      06-04-2019, 07:07 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
If you can stomach the Benz ergonomics, interior and exterior design, heck everything awkward looking and feeling that make it a Benz they make stellar FI engines and a V8 to boot. Personally EVERYTHING about a Benz feels and looks wrong to me, can't stand them, except the engines. The only one I would consider is the G Klasse but now a days it's as cliche' as a Rolex.
I can agree with this.
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      06-04-2019, 04:22 PM   #44
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I like the AMG's too, they look great on the outside certainly. One thing I can't past though, you have this very masculine looking car with huge wheels and wide tires, quad exhausts, twin turbo V8s, and then to put the car in gear you tap a little stalk off of the steering wheel with your index finger. I HATE that. I want to put the car in gear with some oomph. How much room are they really saving with that flimsy little stalk? Details matter to me.
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