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      09-10-2019, 10:46 PM   #683
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Damn all prior front ends look so dated now. Seeing them like this really highlights that it was time for a major change. At his current time and into the future no doubt I prefer the new concept.
I feel the same way. SCOTT26 alluded to this as well. It'll be interesting to see how many people register for the forum around the time that the new cars are made available to the public with threads titled, "New to BMW and I just picked up my new 4/M3/M4...." ...or, "Long time lurker, but I finally joined the family. Pics of my new 4/M3/M4."
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      09-10-2019, 11:04 PM   #684
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Looking good i like the flowing lines a lot more then the boxy shape of BMWs of past.

The grill won't mention it cause it won't make production but reading through this thread good to see so many leaving BMW good to get rid of the negativity from the brand, then again concept is concept so calm your t**s crying babies.

Although quite disappointed not seeing anything regarding the I4 would love to see something from them regarding the test mule i saw a while back based on the 4 series.
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      09-10-2019, 11:12 PM   #685
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The grill won't mention it cause it won't make production
I have some bad news...
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      09-10-2019, 11:14 PM   #686
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The grill won't mention it cause it won't make production
I have some bad news...
He's still in denial. There are a few that are living in an alternate reality.
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      09-10-2019, 11:15 PM   #687
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The new m8 does it better

This looks like a scaled down and ugly version of the m8 that was revealed previously. similar GT profiles with drastically different front and back design.
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      09-10-2019, 11:16 PM   #688
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
I feel the same way. SCOTT26 alluded to this as well. It'll be interesting to see how many people register for the forum around the time that the new cars are made available to the public with threads titled, "New to BMW and I just picked up my new 4/M3/M4...." ...or, "Long time lurker, but I finally joined the family. Pics of my new 4/M3/M4."
You may be onto something here.

This design may not be everyone's cup of tea and regardless of precedent for vertical kidney-grilles in BMW's history, the overall design & interpretation is far from what most of us would consider as 'orthodox' BMW, especially amongst post WWII BMWs.
Design-wise, post-war BMWs have largely been defined (as far as ideological origins) by the Neue Klasse vehicles. Yes, Bangle/Van Hooydonk stirred it up a bit in the early-mid 2000s but much of the overall proportions largely stayed in tact, albeit with a more liberal interpretations to keep things interesting.

And even then, the E65 7er became a best-seller and there is an argument to be made that the flame-surfaced models of the E85/E86 Z4 and E60 5er have aged exceptionally well for their age, especially in M-guise.

This BMW Concept 4, then, represents a sort of departure (when taken in the context of Neue Klasse - F-chassis).
Perhaps this might provide a shock that in hindsight might be beneficial to BMW, much like the twisting surfaces of the 2000s vs. geometrically straight & chiseled lines of the late 80s to late 90s were seen as revolutionary but are now standard design features.
Or maybe this will prove to be a flop, but only time will tell.

What I know for sure though, is that this design can also be a blessing in disguise.
For those who appreciate the designs of the late modern BMWs, this design takes nothing away from the beauty or lure of them.
Rather, the Concept 4's departure of design actually solidifies & ties its predecessors to their respective time periods.

Part of the allure of cars, particularly a car that has such a famed history (such as the BMW M3), is being able to compare and appreciate the generations through time.
I like the late 80s look of the E30 with its defined quad-headlamps & boxy-looks, the quintessentially 90s design of the E36, etc.
An E30 M3 or even my own E90 M3 loses no appreciation due to the existence of newer designs.
The F8x might briefly look dated compared to the G8x, no doubt, but then after a while, it will have its own appreciation, much like how the E30 looks undeniably 'old', but not in a bad way.
The real allure of the BMW M3/M4 is that they are truly benchmarks of their time. I do hope that the next M3/M4, even with a front end inspired/derived from this design, will be executed appropriately.
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      09-10-2019, 11:25 PM   #689
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Damn all prior front ends look so dated now. Seeing them like this really highlights that it was time for a major change. At his current time and into the future no doubt I prefer the new concept.
I feel the same way. SCOTT26 alluded to this as well. It'll be interesting to see how many people register for the forum around the time that the new cars are made available to the public with threads titled, "New to BMW and I just picked up my new 4/M3/M4...." ...or, "Long time lurker, but I finally joined the family. Pics of my new 4/M3/M4."
I know many people will get it, but I went back to the concept f32 reveal and the forum was generally very positive. It was well received and BMW really pumped out the amazing f82. Really not sure if the g8x will do as well in the future.

https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=775876
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      09-10-2019, 11:27 PM   #690
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by EVC View Post
That's a hideous example of a company failing to understand its customer base.

BMW has done tons of innovation over the years but they are always behind the curve in technology. Maybe instead of playing catch-up on a played out design (big ugly grills) they should think about why my Son's 25k Subaru has more technology in it than my 60k BMW. Audi seems to keep up just fine. Why not BMW?
...Or....a reflection of a company that fully understands its customer base. WE, as an enthusiast forum, are not representative of the base as a whole.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by EVC View Post
That's a hideous example of a company failing to understand its customer base.

BMW has done tons of innovation over the years but they are always behind the curve in technology. Maybe instead of playing catch-up on a played out design (big ugly grills) they should think about why my Son's 25k Subaru has more technology in it than my 60k BMW. Audi seems to keep up just fine. Why not BMW?
...Or....a reflection of a company that fully understands its customer base. WE, as an enthusiast forum, are not representative of the base as a whole.
I dunno, there are a pretty broad range of age groups represented here. I mentioned the grill thing to my local sales rep and she basically said, very few people like it, most hate it. But, BMW isn't going to let go of it. They seem to think it's going to sell. To whom? I have no idea. Maybe they are looking to broaden their market share by attracting atypical buyers. Personally, I'll jump brands before they see me in one of those "artistic" boondoggles.
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      09-10-2019, 11:37 PM   #691
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Law View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
I feel the same way. SCOTT26 alluded to this as well. It'll be interesting to see how many people register for the forum around the time that the new cars are made available to the public with threads titled, "New to BMW and I just picked up my new 4/M3/M4...." ...or, "Long time lurker, but I finally joined the family. Pics of my new 4/M3/M4."
You may be onto something here.

This design may not be everyone's cup of tea and regardless of precedent for vertical kidney-grilles in BMW's history, the overall design & interpretation is far from what most of us would consider as 'orthodox' BMW, especially amongst post WWII BMWs.
Design-wise, post-war BMWs have largely been defined (as far as ideological origins) by the Neue Klasse vehicles. Yes, Bangle/Van Hooydonk stirred it up a bit in the early-mid 2000s but much of the overall proportions largely stayed in tact, albeit with a more liberal interpretations to keep things interesting.

And even then, the E65 7er became a best-seller and there is an argument to be made that the flame-surfaced models of the E85/E86 Z4 and E60 5er have aged exceptionally well for their age, especially in M-guise.

This BMW Concept 4, then, represents a sort of departure (when taken in the context of Neue Klasse - F-chassis).
Perhaps this might provide a shock that in hindsight might be beneficial to BMW, much like the twisting surfaces of the 2000s vs. geometrically straight & chiseled lines of the late 80s to late 90s were seen as revolutionary but are now standard design features.
Or maybe this will prove to be a flop, but only time will tell.

What I know for sure though, is that this design can also be a blessing in disguise.
For those who appreciate the designs of the late modern BMWs, this design takes nothing away from the beauty or lure of them.
Rather, the Concept 4's departure of design actually solidifies & ties its predecessors to their respective time periods.

Part of the allure of cars, particularly a car that has such a famed history (such as the BMW M3), is being able to compare and appreciate the generations through time.
I like the late 80s look of the E30 with its defined quad-headlamps & boxy-looks, the quintessentially 90s design of the E36, etc.
An E30 M3 or even my own E90 M3 loses no appreciation due to the existence of newer designs.
The F8x might briefly look dated compared to the G8x, no doubt, but then after a while, it will have its own appreciation, much like how the E30 looks undeniably 'old', but not in a bad way.
The real allure of the BMW M3/M4 is that they are truly benchmarks of their time. I do hope that the next M3/M4, even with a front end inspired/derived from this design, will be executed appropriately.
Great post man!
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      09-10-2019, 11:37 PM   #692
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EVC View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by EVC View Post
That's a hideous example of a company failing to understand its customer base.

BMW has done tons of innovation over the years but they are always behind the curve in technology. Maybe instead of playing catch-up on a played out design (big ugly grills) they should think about why my Son's 25k Subaru has more technology in it than my 60k BMW. Audi seems to keep up just fine. Why not BMW?
...Or....a reflection of a company that fully understands its customer base. WE, as an enthusiast forum, are not representative of the base as a whole.
I dunno, there are a pretty broad range of age groups represented here. I mentioned the grill thing to my local sales rep and she basically said, very few people like it, most hate it. But, BMW isn't going to let go of it. They seem to think it's going to sell. To whom? I have no idea. Maybe they are looking to broaden their market share by attracting atypical buyers. Personally, I'll jump brands before they see me in one of those "artistic" boondoggles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EVC View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by EVC View Post
That's a hideous example of a company failing to understand its customer base.

BMW has done tons of innovation over the years but they are always behind the curve in technology. Maybe instead of playing catch-up on a played out design (big ugly grills) they should think about why my Son's 25k Subaru has more technology in it than my 60k BMW. Audi seems to keep up just fine. Why not BMW?
...Or....a reflection of a company that fully understands its customer base. WE, as an enthusiast forum, are not representative of the base as a whole.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by EVC View Post
That's a hideous example of a company failing to understand its customer base.

BMW has done tons of innovation over the years but they are always behind the curve in technology. Maybe instead of playing catch-up on a played out design (big ugly grills) they should think about why my Son's 25k Subaru has more technology in it than my 60k BMW. Audi seems to keep up just fine. Why not BMW?
...Or....a reflection of a company that fully understands its customer base. WE, as an enthusiast forum, are not representative of the base as a whole.
I dunno, there are a pretty broad range of age groups represented here. I mentioned the grill thing to my local sales rep and she basically said, very few people like it, most hate it. But, BMW isn't going to let go of it. They seem to think it's going to sell. To whom? I have no idea. Maybe they are looking to broaden their market share by attracting atypical buyers. Personally, I'll jump brands before they see me in one of those "artistic" boondoggles.

She must be ancient... who says boondoggles?
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      09-10-2019, 11:46 PM   #693
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drj161 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Damn all prior front ends look so dated now. Seeing them like this really highlights that it was time for a major change. At his current time and into the future no doubt I prefer the new concept.
I feel the same way. SCOTT26 alluded to this as well. It'll be interesting to see how many people register for the forum around the time that the new cars are made available to the public with threads titled, "New to BMW and I just picked up my new 4/M3/M4...." ...or, "Long time lurker, but I finally joined the family. Pics of my new 4/M3/M4."
I know many people will get it, but I went back to the concept f32 reveal and the forum was generally very positive. It was well received and BMW really pumped out the amazing f82. Really not sure if the g8x will do as well in the future.

https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=775876
I agree about the reception. That I cannot dispute, but people well above our respective pay grades obviously saw something in the stats. This is a major move by BMW; a move that wasn't whimsical (...which is another reason why comments about this concept being a ruse, a joke....or a ploy confound me). This isn't a game. This is a major automotive marquee that was used to smashing the competition for at least 10 years straight, only to witness Mercedes dominate them the last three years (...and thankfully the X SAV's and the new 7 have helped claw back some market share). That is not something this company is accustomed to. Something had to change.
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      09-10-2019, 11:46 PM   #694
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The G22/F82 can keep all this front-end flair; I just hope the next gen M2 gets a traditional grill, sort of like the M8

#FingersCrossed
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      09-10-2019, 11:49 PM   #695
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Quote:
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The G22/F80 can keep all this front-end flair; I just hope the next gen M2 gets a traditional grill, sort of like the M8

#FingersCrossed
The next 2/M2 is getting a grill similar to the new 4/M3/M4, albeit smaller and more appropriate for the size of the 2, but still larger and similar in shape/form to what BMW presented at Frankfurt. This has already been confirmed by SCOTT26. He has seen the new 2. Believe him!
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      09-10-2019, 11:53 PM   #696
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EVC View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by EVC View Post
That's a hideous example of a company failing to understand its customer base.

BMW has done tons of innovation over the years but they are always behind the curve in technology. Maybe instead of playing catch-up on a played out design (big ugly grills) they should think about why my Son's 25k Subaru has more technology in it than my 60k BMW. Audi seems to keep up just fine. Why not BMW?
...Or....a reflection of a company that fully understands its customer base. WE, as an enthusiast forum, are not representative of the base as a whole.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by EVC View Post
That's a hideous example of a company failing to understand its customer base.

BMW has done tons of innovation over the years but they are always behind the curve in technology. Maybe instead of playing catch-up on a played out design (big ugly grills) they should think about why my Son's 25k Subaru has more technology in it than my 60k BMW. Audi seems to keep up just fine. Why not BMW?
...Or....a reflection of a company that fully understands its customer base. WE, as an enthusiast forum, are not representative of the base as a whole.
I dunno, there are a pretty broad range of age groups represented here. I mentioned the grill thing to my local sales rep and she basically said, very few people like it, most hate it. But, BMW isn't going to let go of it. They seem to think it's going to sell. To whom? I have no idea. Maybe they are looking to broaden their market share by attracting atypical buyers. Personally, I'll jump brands before they see me in one of those "artistic" boondoggles.
That is true in the demographic sense, but you've got to think globally. BMW's statisticians, bean counters, designers, market analysts, etc. all see the back side of this. We're merely front end consumers, and very few BMW owners I come across - outside of a focused car event - have even heard of Bimmerpost. I met a young guy named Gianni in downtown San Diego on Saturday with a Lime Rock Gray ///M4CS. He was admiring my Nardo car and appreciating the differences/similarities in paint, options, etc. I asked him what his username was on Bimmerpost, as I assumed he was in a demographic that would surely be aware of BMW's Rennlist. He replied, "What's Bimmerpost?!" I invited him to join the forum and gave him a rundown. I truly hope he joins. That experienced echoes nearly every experience that I've had dealing with BMW drivers that I've pulled over. Majority in my experience are not familiar with this site. My point is that the internet crowd may not be as significant as you think in the grand scheme of things.
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      09-11-2019, 12:03 AM   #697
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Feeling even better about that e90 m3 purchase now.
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      09-11-2019, 12:44 AM   #698
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Everything But The Grill.

This Concept is is everything the 4’ ever wanted but that grill is just wrong. Too much, OTT, and please no.

This is concept car BMW, it is not too late to do that nose job.
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      09-11-2019, 12:50 AM   #699
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This Concept is is everything the 4’ ever wanted but that grill is just wrong. Too much, OTT, and please no.

This is concept car BMW, it is not too late to do that nose job.
Porsche is calling your name.
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      09-11-2019, 12:51 AM   #700
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the car is beautiful if you take out the front grille. I hope a last minute change of mind from all the negative sentiments from the public will cause BMW to change the front end. One thing BMW does a little better than MB and Audi is listen to it's customers.
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      09-11-2019, 01:06 AM   #701
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the car is beautiful if you take out the front grille. I hope a last minute change of mind from all the negative sentiments from the public will cause BMW to change the front end. One thing BMW does a little better than MB and Audi is listen to it's customers.
It seems like some of you guys won't accept that this IS the new face of BMW until we're two years deep into the model run. This design language will touch the i4, 4, 2, 2GC, M2/3/4, and some other E-models. Accept it!
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      09-11-2019, 01:15 AM   #702
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CSL Hommage anyone..?

The front end is very close.
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      09-11-2019, 01:32 AM   #703
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Telling the truth I do like it.
It looks aggressive/sleek and all of us will get used to "kidneys"
What kidneys? They resemble buttocks in this concept car.
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      09-11-2019, 01:35 AM   #704
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 440xiGCMSport2 View Post
the car is beautiful if you take out the front grille. I hope a last minute change of mind from all the negative sentiments from the public will cause BMW to change the front end. One thing BMW does a little better than MB and Audi is listen to it's customers.
It seems like some of you guys won't accept that this IS the new face of BMW until we're two years deep into the model run. This design language will touch the i4, 4, 2, 2GC, M2/3/4, and some other E-models. Accept it!
Embrace the twin asscheeks grill!
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