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2019+ BMW 3 AND 4-SERIES FORUMS (G2x Generation) General G20 Sedan / G22 Coupe / G26 Gran Coupe Discussions BMW G22 4 Series Coupe Has Been Spied!

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      01-11-2020, 08:21 PM   #397
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Quote:
Originally Posted by am3r1ka View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hegge View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by am3r1ka View Post
I imagine this will be 6 series size dimensions. Welcome to the new 6 series.
Exactly what I was thinking, looks like a new 6 series. I have no interest in large cars. The reveal of the 8 series last year did nothing for me and this doesn't either.

While a future M4 CSL will be impressive, it will probably be overpriced and won't sell well.
Yeah the M4 CS/L already exists in a niche market of buyers. Plus the people who just want to brag usually just top out at the comp model. Don't expect for the next generation to sale as much either.

I really hope the 4 series don't evolve into GT proportions but it seems inevitable with how big cars keeps getting. 2 series might be the last hope.
GT proportions are definitely coming to gran coupes. There's a reason why the 2GC's tall rear end looks so familiar...
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      01-11-2020, 08:27 PM   #398
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
That was a tweet sent to Mercedes by BMW USA. Without clarification from The mother ship in Munich. But touché to Mercedes-Benz.
In Munich we are more conservative on these tit-for-tat social media responses.
See the retirement video with the ex-chairman of Mercedes-Benz driving off in the i8 Roadster.
I would not say they are dumb at Munich.
The 4 design is seen to bring forth more presence after years of being acceptable conservatism.
Today car design within many involves the alphabet of car brands and selecting the best parts of that brands design and applying them. The 4 is the core sporty model as it leads to the M and Motorsport.
It's important that this Performance has an appearance that showcases this is a performance car but relates on some level to its vast gene pool from it's historic linage. The basic ideas are not new,but are historically familiar and interpreted to be aesthetically far more progressive.
There is that speak again. I think I am going to need a translator.
Allow me to translate that for you:
"Don't stop thinking about tomorrow
Don't stop, it'll soon be here
It'll be, better than before
Yesterday's gone, yesterday's gone"
But ...wait a sec, from hindsight, yesterday wasn't so bad at all.
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      01-11-2020, 08:34 PM   #399
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Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
That was a tweet ....It's important that this Performance has an appearance that showcases ... vast gene pool from it's historic linage. The basic ideas are not new,but are historically familiar and interpreted to be aesthetically far more progressive.
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Originally Posted by J-RO View Post
There is that speak again. I think I am going to need a translator.
"we're going with the beaver-mobile"

"After a 3 month project evaluating our options, management says it's too expensive to change course"

"We've hired a PR crisis firm - they're writing my posts now"
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      01-12-2020, 12:05 AM   #400
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While a future M4 CSL will be impressive, it will probably be overpriced and won't sell well.
If BMW honor the G82 with a CSL which I doubt you can bet your @ss that it will sell. There’s only been two CSL cars ever and they are most excellent, coveted and beloved cars. I would be shocked if BMW drag the CSL badge through the mudd with anything less than excellent.






The GTS felt overpriced but it’s never been a badge uttered with the same admiration and passion as CSL.

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      01-12-2020, 08:42 AM   #401
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hegge View Post
While a future M4 CSL will be impressive, it will probably be overpriced and won't sell well.
If BMW honor the G82 with a CSL which I doubt you can bet your @ss that it will sell. There's only been two CSL cars ever and they are most excellent, coveted and beloved cars. I would be shocked if BMW drag the CSL badge through the mudd with anything less than excellent.

[IMG]https://cdn.bmwblog.com/wp-content/u...-2-830x553.jpg[/IMG]


[IMG]https://www.sportscarmarket.com/wp-c...-csl-front.jpg[/IMG]

The GTS felt overpriced but it's never been a badge uttered with the same admiration and passion as CSL.
My challenge with a CSL version of the upcoming M4 is that what we have seen for years of these special edition models has been exterior colors, interior elements in Alcántara and perhaps new color wheels as well. Then they add all of the over the counter Performance accessories to it. Is that really worthy of a CSL badge? A CSL needs to be a truly exclusive variant that includes unique front and rear aerodynamics, exclusive seats, dashboard elements with CSL branding, special tuning, CSL specific suspension, custom wheels, custom exhaust and limited availability. And all that without a price tag of a 911 S. It's a tough proposition.
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      01-12-2020, 12:28 PM   #402
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My challenge with a CSL version of the upcoming M4 is that what we have seen for years of these special edition models has been exterior colors, interior elements in Alcántara and perhaps new color wheels as well. Then they add all of the over the counter Performance accessories to it. Is that really worthy of a CSL badge? A CSL needs to be a truly exclusive variant that includes unique front and rear aerodynamics, exclusive seats, dashboard elements with CSL branding, special tuning, CSL specific suspension, custom wheels, custom exhaust and limited availability. And all that without a price tag of a 911 S. It's a tough proposition.
No absolutely not but that’s not been the case with the CSL.
The CSL has to be la lot lighter and faster on the track not just a blinged up version of the standard car. The E46 M3 CSL for example was around 10% lighter than the standard M3 and it was faster than the E92 M3, the F82 M4 and the 997 911S around the ring.

That’s why I doubt BMW will make the effort of making another CSL, too much work to not disappoint and shame this badge.
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      01-12-2020, 04:46 PM   #403
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Looks very soft and boring around the corners but is extremely stable.
This will have the same or very similar setup with M340i. So it will be far from soft and boring. On the contrary, it will be very sharp and fun. And unlike M340i, the front end design won't be boring...
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      01-13-2020, 12:58 AM   #404
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuastein55 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by am3r1ka View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hegge View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by am3r1ka View Post
I imagine this will be 6 series size dimensions. Welcome to the new 6 series.
Exactly what I was thinking, looks like a new 6 series. I have no interest in large cars. The reveal of the 8 series last year did nothing for me and this doesn't either.

While a future M4 CSL will be impressive, it will probably be overpriced and won't sell well.
Yeah the M4 CS/L already exists in a niche market of buyers. Plus the people who just want to brag usually just top out at the comp model. Don't expect for the next generation to sale as much either.

I really hope the 4 series don't evolve into GT proportions but it seems inevitable with how big cars keeps getting. 2 series might be the last hope.
GT proportions are definitely coming to gran coupes. There's a reason why the 2GC's tall rear end looks so familiar...
Remember that the 2gc is only a 2 series in name, it's built on a 1 series platform. The 1 series is a fwd hatch back, hence the awkward looking stance of the 2gc.

Do you realize that you almost never post anything positive here anymore? I understand that you might not like most new models that bmw has been releasing, but then why are you still so active here? Why stick around just to constantly criticize a corporation that's going in a direction that you are no longer interested in? Don't get me wrong, you've crafted some detailed, well written posts, I'm just trying to understand the psychology of the critics here. Maybe the act of critiquing provides satisfaction as an end itself? Perhaps it's in the belief that one can influence the direction of an international corporation via criticism voiced on Internet forums. I don't know, but it's a curiosity of mine.
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      01-13-2020, 01:44 AM   #405
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hegge View Post
Exactly what I was thinking, looks like a new 6 series. I have no interest in large cars. The reveal of the 8 series last year did nothing for me and this doesn't either.
Yep 8 series looks like a boat to me. I'm 5'9" and felt like a midget sitting inside.

I hope G22 won't exceed the dimensions of the G20. When I had a G20 loaner I was surprised at how instantly I could feel out the external boundaries of the vehicle while driving. So it's not a boat quite yet.
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      01-13-2020, 02:17 AM   #406
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If the designers were so confident in their grille design why are they “testing it out” on their lower volume vehicles like the 4, M 3/4 series. I don’t see it on the 3 and 5 series. (Thankfully)
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      01-13-2020, 04:15 AM   #407
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If the designers were so confident in their grille design why are they "testing it out" on their lower volume vehicles like the 4, M 3/4 series. I don't see it on the 3 and 5 series. (Thankfully)
I don't see it that way. I think the intent behind the grill is a brash, sporty persona. The 5 isn't what most of us would call a sporty car, and neither is the 3 really.
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      01-13-2020, 06:07 AM   #408
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Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
I don't see it that way. I think the intent behind the grill is a brash, sporty persona. The 5 isn't what most of us would call a sporty car, and neither is the 3 really.
They do offer an M5.
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      01-13-2020, 06:32 AM   #409
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The "neue" BMW grille has become an internet meme and the world has responded with overwhelming criticism.
*Car guys* have responded with overwhelming criticism. The general public has not. My wife loves the X7. Her main criticism of German SUVs was that they're too round and pointy. The big square front end makes it look more prestigious. I believe her exact words were, "No one wants a dinky looking car or SUV."

You can imagine my frustration when I showed her the G8x leaks and she loved it. I posted it on my instagram story and several friends messaged me asking about it. It is what it is
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      01-13-2020, 07:19 AM   #410
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*Car guys* have responded with overwhelming criticism. The general public has not. My wife loves the X7. Her main criticism of German SUVs was that they're too round and pointy. The big square front end makes it look more prestigious. I believe her exact words were, "No one wants a dinky looking car or SUV."

You can imagine my frustration when I showed her the G8x leaks and she loved it. I posted it on my instagram story and several friends messaged me asking about it. It is what it is
This is exactly what I've found as well. I decided to post a simple crude poll on my Instagram of the 4 series concept right after I saw it in person at Frankfurt, simply do you like it or hate it. The result was that those interested in cars all hated the look whereas those not interested ('general public') thought it looked great. Perhaps the surprise for me was the end result which showed there being a majority for liking the design. The general public's perception outweighed those of petrol heads. Perhaps we will see that trend in real life once its released
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      01-13-2020, 07:50 AM   #411
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"those interested in cars all hated the look whereas those not interested ('general public') thought it looked great."

Seems to me that those not interested in cars do not buy cars so why would BMW care about their opinion.
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      01-13-2020, 10:15 AM   #412
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
I don't see it that way. I think the intent behind the grill is a brash, sporty persona. The 5 isn't what most of us would call a sporty car, and neither is the 3 really.
Wait till you see the imminent new 5 and M5. For the M5 they have sharpened up the front aerodynamics a bit, plus there is a bigger grille on the LCI 5.
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      01-13-2020, 10:27 AM   #413
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J-RO View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan View Post
I don't see it that way. I think the intent behind the grill is a brash, sporty persona. The 5 isn't what most of us would call a sporty car, and neither is the 3 really.
They do offer an M5.
There's also an M3 too. Obviously I was referring to the non-M variants.
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      01-13-2020, 10:40 AM   #414
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuller View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuastein55 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by am3r1ka View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hegge View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by am3r1ka View Post
I imagine this will be 6 series size dimensions. Welcome to the new 6 series.
Exactly what I was thinking, looks like a new 6 series. I have no interest in large cars. The reveal of the 8 series last year did nothing for me and this doesn't either.

While a future M4 CSL will be impressive, it will probably be overpriced and won't sell well.
Yeah the M4 CS/L already exists in a niche market of buyers. Plus the people who just want to brag usually just top out at the comp model. Don't expect for the next generation to sale as much either.

I really hope the 4 series don't evolve into GT proportions but it seems inevitable with how big cars keeps getting. 2 series might be the last hope.
GT proportions are definitely coming to gran coupes. There's a reason why the 2GC's tall rear end looks so familiar...
Remember that the 2gc is only a 2 series in name, it's built on a 1 series platform. The 1 series is a fwd hatch back, hence the awkward looking stance of the 2gc.

Do you realize that you almost never post anything positive here anymore? I understand that you might not like most new models that bmw has been releasing, but then why are you still so active here? Why stick around just to constantly criticize a corporation that's going in a direction that you are no longer interested in? Don't get me wrong, you've crafted some detailed, well written posts, I'm just trying to understand the psychology of the critics here. Maybe the act of critiquing provides satisfaction as an end itself? Perhaps it's in the belief that one can influence the direction of an international corporation via criticism voiced on Internet forums. I don't know, but it's a curiosity of mine.
All I simply said was the 2GC's rear end looks reminiscent of the 5GT, and that GT proportions were coming based on spy shots of the i4 and 4er Gran Coupe. You can take that as criticism if you want it but no where did I say it was ugly or stupid, I simply just said that taller GT proportions are going to be infused with GC design, as this was confirmed long ago on Bimmerpost when BMW cancelled all GT's.

This is the 4-Series thread, there isn't much positive here regardless of who posts it, this is probably the worst thread to be in if you are looking for positive comments regarding the 4er's design/BMW's future, because most enthusiasts simply don't like it, and have the right to voice their opinion on that with this new 4er being extremely controversial.

I'm still on Bimmerpost as I still own a BMW and still post lots of content here, many of the threads being positive (BMW being #1 in sales, many comparison tests of BMW winning, Apple Carplay coming for us, my fun time with a Z4 loaner) and have the right to do so. Earlier this month I wrote a whole thread on how the Z4 is a great vehicle in BMW's lineup, one that is so close to having me buy it if it had a manual. Did I give some constructive feedback on how the car could be a bit better? Yes, as no car is perfect, but if you read that article, I state it is one of my favorite modern BMW's and that owners are very lucky to have a great vehicle in their garages. It might not have been the most popular as the G29 forums are pretty quiet, but there is a lot of positive content there. On here I've helped voice my opinion as to what BMW perspective buyers should look at whether that be specific models, options, what to look out for reliability wise, what cars to compare it to, etc. As they've asked for the help of owners and I love to help out any way I can. I've congratulated new owners on their beautiful cars as I really am happy for them and that they've bought some great bimmers, and posted articles that I think people would find interesting such as Apple Carplay finally being free, or a comparison test between the Giulia and 3-Series.

Are there some articles where I have criticized BMW? Of course, but that is what many of us do. BMW will never be perfect, as no brand can, and criticism always can lead to a better and more positive future. If people hadn't criticized BMW charging for Apple Carplay a feature that is free in most economy cars, what else could BMW try to get us to pay subscriptions for? I do remember there was a rumor to make safety options a subscriptions, so sometimes, criticism is necessary.

Do I not like some new BMW's? Yes, BMW is not perfect, so of course I won't like everything they offer. I don't care for the 5 or 7 series and possibly this new 4-series' design, so if someone is asking for owners opinions on these vehicles, I'm always honest with how I felt about my 5er. Regarding the 2,3,X3,X5, and X7, I've stated many times that I do find these vehicles to be very good, and most of the times to be class leaders, and I have even shared posts about getting an X3 for myself on the G01 forums after my son takes his to college.

So yes, I do criticize BMW as I have the right to share my opinion even if certain people don't like it, but I have my fair share of praise and positive posts on here, and at the end of the day, this is the internet, there'll be plenty more people who will criticize or praise BMW as well.
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      01-13-2020, 10:47 AM   #415
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J-RO View Post
"those interested in cars all hated the look whereas those not interested ('general public') thought it looked great."

Seems to me that those not interested in cars do not buy cars so why would BMW care about their opinion.
"Those not interested in cars" = those that think of cars as an appliance, not those that don't buy cars. BMW cares about their opinion more because their wallets actually hit BMWs pockets while most enthusiasts shop on the used market.

Just look at the BR-Z. They gave people what they asked for, an inexpensive rear wheel drive sports car. After 2 years, sales tanked. I expect the same thing from the Supra, RS6, etc. It sucks, but the cars they build for us don't sell because most of us would rather save 30% and buy lightly used vs spend money on new cars.
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      01-13-2020, 10:50 AM   #416
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuastein55 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuller View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuastein55 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by am3r1ka View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hegge View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by am3r1ka View Post
I imagine this will be 6 series size dimensions. Welcome to the new 6 series.
Exactly what I was thinking, looks like a new 6 series. I have no interest in large cars. The reveal of the 8 series last year did nothing for me and this doesn't either.

While a future M4 CSL will be impressive, it will probably be overpriced and won't sell well.
Yeah the M4 CS/L already exists in a niche market of buyers. Plus the people who just want to brag usually just top out at the comp model. Don't expect for the next generation to sale as much either.

I really hope the 4 series don't evolve into GT proportions but it seems inevitable with how big cars keeps getting. 2 series might be the last hope.
GT proportions are definitely coming to gran coupes. There's a reason why the 2GC's tall rear end looks so familiar...
Remember that the 2gc is only a 2 series in name, it's built on a 1 series platform. The 1 series is a fwd hatch back, hence the awkward looking stance of the 2gc.

Do you realize that you almost never post anything positive here anymore? I understand that you might not like most new models that bmw has been releasing, but then why are you still so active here? Why stick around just to constantly criticize a corporation that's going in a direction that you are no longer interested in? Don't get me wrong, you've crafted some detailed, well written posts, I'm just trying to understand the psychology of the critics here. Maybe the act of critiquing provides satisfaction as an end itself? Perhaps it's in the belief that one can influence the direction of an international corporation via criticism voiced on Internet forums. I don't know, but it's a curiosity of mine.
All I simply said was the 2GC's rear end looks reminiscent of the 5GT, and that GT proportions were coming based on spy shots of the i4 and 4er Gran Coupe. You can take that as criticism if you want it but no where did I say it was ugly or stupid, I simply just said that taller GT proportions are going to be infused with GC design, as this was confirmed long ago on Bimmerpost when BMW cancelled all GT's.

This is the 4-Series thread, there isn't much positive here regardless of who posts it, this is probably the worst thread to be in if you are looking for positive comments regarding the 4er's design/BMW's future, because most enthusiasts simply don't like it, and have the right to voice their opinion on that with this new 4er being extremely controversial.

I'm still on Bimmerpost as I still own a BMW and still post lots of content here, many of the threads being positive (BMW being #1 in sales, many comparison tests of BMW winning, Apple Carplay coming for us, my fun time with a Z4 loaner) and have the right to do so. Earlier this month I wrote a whole thread on how the Z4 is a great vehicle in BMW's lineup, one that is so close to having me buy it if it had a manual. Did I give some constructive feedback on how the car could be a bit better? Yes, as no car is perfect, but if you read that article, I state it is one of my favorite modern BMW's and that owners are very lucky to have a great vehicle in their garages. It might not have been the most popular as the G29 forums are pretty quiet, but there is a lot of positive content there. On here I've helped voice my opinion as to what BMW perspective buyers should look at whether that be specific models, options, what to look out for reliability wise, what cars to compare it to, etc. As they've asked for the help of owners and I love to help out any way I can. I've congratulated new owners on their beautiful cars as I really am happy for them and that they've bought some great bimmers, and posted articles that I think people would find interesting such as Apple Carplay finally being free, or a comparison test between the Giulia and 3-Series.

Are there some articles where I have criticized BMW? Of course, but that is what many of us do. BMW will never be perfect, as no brand can, and criticism always can lead to a better and more positive future. If people hadn't criticized BMW charging for Apple Carplay a feature that is free in most economy cars, what else could BMW try to get us to pay subscriptions for? I do remember there was a rumor to make safety options a subscriptions, so sometimes, criticism is necessary.

Do I not like some new BMW's? Yes, BMW is not perfect, so of course I won't like everything they offer. I don't care for the 5 or 7 series and possibly this new 4-series' design, so if someone is asking for owners opinions on these vehicles, I'm always honest with how I felt about my 5er. Regarding the 2,3,X3,X5, and X7, I've stated many times that I do find these vehicles to be very good, and most of the times to be class leaders, and I have even shared posts about getting an X3 for myself on the G01 forums after my son takes his to college.

So yes, I do criticize BMW as I have the right to share my opinion even if certain people don't like it, but I have my fair share of praise and positive posts on here, and at the end of the day, this is the internet, there'll be plenty more people who will criticize or praise BMW as well.
You're entitled to your opinion, but you shouldn't make statements such as "most enthusiasts hate the design". There's no way for you to quantify that statement. The microcosm that is Bimmerpost is not representative of the world.
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      01-13-2020, 11:05 AM   #417
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Is it just me, or does anyone else get a Mustang-y vibe from the overall shape of the car (really noticed it in the video). Not a huge fan
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      01-13-2020, 08:27 PM   #418
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Another render that i found.... It's hideous! 🤮
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