[Soul_Glo]

Originally Posted by LarryMarcia

“Takes time to break in.” Is that a joke or serious? Didn’t know solid state electronics take time to break in and I’m an engineer (but mechanical not electrical).

I love my new 330, but mostly dislike everything about the HK system, except the logos on the screens.

Anyway, Thanks I’ll try this as Ive been playing with the settings posted on this site for a few weeks with no real improvement. Listen mostly to classic rock and R and B.

Have a great day.

Here is more on running in speakers. Listening to music with a dynamic range helps to loosen up new coils. Even if polarity cannot be reversed.

https://www.cambridgeaudio.com/usa/e...w-run-speakers

So breaking in is not a joke. Also discussed here:

https://x3.xbimmers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=721725

What are you not feeling about HK? Bass?

[LarryMarcia]

“Takes time to break in.” Is that a joke or serious? Didn’t know solid state electronics take time to break in and I’m an engineer (but mechanical not electrical).

I love my new 330, but mostly dislike everything about the HK system, except the logos on the screens.

Anyway, Thanks I’ll try this as Ive been playing with the settings posted on this site for a few weeks with no real improvement. Listen mostly to classic rock and R and B.

Have a great day.

[zazzau]

Originally Posted by Soul_Glo

I have used these settings from my F30 days and applied them to the G20. Courtesy of… doesn’t seem to be on the forum anymore but if he is lurking he might recognise these:

Bass & Treble = Flat (sometimes Bass +1)
Balance & Fader = Centered
L7 active
(Speed Volume = Center)
100Hz +4 (sometimes +5)
200HZ-5
500HZ +2
1kHz +1
2kHz Flat
5kHz -1
10kHz Flat

It’s important to note the system takes time to break in. Listen to a range of music. Use it. Go medium-high now and again. You will start to notice the sound improvements with time.

On my F30. After 30k miles. It was sweet.
The G20 has less power than the F30 HK.
Apparently the G20 LCI has improved HK.

There are countless recommendations for settings out there. These above work well with jazz, hiphop, rnb, country, and classical.

I’ve heard of improved HK on LCI as well. Wondering if it just has a better amp.

[MichaelNRW]

I also used the F30 settings in my G21 but like to try the settings from elambo.

[Soul_Glo]

Originally Posted by LarryMarcia

“Takes time to break in.” Is that a joke or serious? Didn’t know solid state electronics take time to break in and I’m an engineer (but mechanical not electrical).

I love my new 330, but mostly dislike everything about the HK system, except the logos on the screens.

Anyway, Thanks I’ll try this as Ive been playing with the settings posted on this site for a few weeks with no real improvement. Listen mostly to classic rock and R and B.

Have a great day.

Here is more on running in speakers. Listening to music with a dynamic range helps to loosen up new coils.

https://www.cambridgeaudio.com/usa/e...w-run-speakers

So breaking in is not a joke.

What are you not feeling about HK? Bass?

[Soul_Glo]

Billfitz our resident fountain of knowledge. Is running/breaking in speakers a joke?!

[LarryMarcia]

(1) I never heard of speakers taking time to break in. Always thought electronic / fiber optic is what it is with essentially no moving parts. Anyway, I guess you learn something new every day. Next time my wife wants to replace a TV or Toaster or most anything else electric, I'll tell her wait, it needs time to break in.

(2) With HK that came with the 3 series I bought, I'm just not feeling any bass, any range, it sounds weak, almost like a portable handheld radio, but somewhat better.

(3). I know most car stereos are made by the same company, Samsung or LG or whatever, but having experienced the Mcintosh in Jeep and Bang and Olufson in Audi, and so many others over the years, it is hard to adjust to such a decrease in sound quality with the HK. Had I never heard other high end systems, the HK would probably sound a bit better to my ears. I've been playing with the HK settings almost every day for the last 2 weeks, and not much has changed.

When I have the extra money, the HK is getting replaced with something much higher end. To me, high end car audio is so important, it makes driving so much more enjoyable!

[Soul_Glo]

Originally Posted by LarryMarcia

(1) I never heard of speakers taking time to break in. Always thought electronic / fiber optic is what it is with essentially no moving parts. Anyway, I guess you learn something new every day. Next time my wife wants to replace a TV or Toaster or most anything else electric, I'll tell her wait, it needs time to break in.

(2) With HK that came with the 3 series I bought, I'm just not feeling any bass, any range, it sounds weak, almost like a portable handheld radio, but somewhat better.

(3). I know most car stereos are made by the same company, Samsung or LG or whatever, but having experienced the Mcintosh in Jeep and Bang and Olufson in Audi, and so many others over the years, it is hard to adjust to such a decrease in sound quality with the HK. Had I never heard other high end systems, the HK would probably sound a bit better to my ears. I've been playing with the HK settings almost every day for the last 2 weeks, and not much has changed.

When I have the extra money, the HK is getting replaced with something much higher end. To me, high end car audio is so important, it makes driving so much more enjoyable!

Is there any bass? When I bought mine there was bass cut. Then no bass. I had nothing to compare it to. Just knew it didn’t sound right. My amplifier (booster) was replaced under warranty. Others have had the same experience:

https://g20.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1724795

I replaced my under seat woofers with SWS. I’m happy with the bass.

[LarryMarcia]

I have the 2023 3 series with HK. There definitely is some bass, just so weak. The amp is fine, I already had service check it, they said a year or two ago some HK amp units needed to be replaced, but mine was fine. The service writer recommended a local car audio installer that they refer, but said a high end upgrade will cost about 4,000, and I don't have that to spend.

He said a lot of M3 owners have replaced the HK components with a French brand called "Focal" and have been very happy and that the same parts will work in any G20.

I think the issue, plain and simple, is that I am a bit spoiled by having heard other systems and how good car audio can truly be. I just took a ride in my neighbor's new Volvo a half an hour ago, he opted for the Bowers & Wilkens upgrade (over the base HK). Wow, the Bowers & Wilkens is also an amazing system - maybe even better than Bang Olufson or McIntosh, and far superior to the HK I have in the 3 series.

However, I am still very happy with my 2023 3 series purchase!

[SLGrassoPA]

A decent upgrade from the Harmon Kardon can probably be done for less than 4K.

Enter your VIN at the Alpha One Bimmer Tech website and it shows if any speaker / amp upgrades etc available.

https://www.bimmer-tech.net/speakers...lifier-for-bmw

[LarryMarcia]

Thank you for that. I plugged in my VIN at the site. It gives me the speaker upgrade, but says no compatible Amp upgrade available. I hope that does not mean I'm stuck with the Harmon; if that were the case I would have found a car without the Harmon in the first place.

[SLGrassoPA]

Maybe try calling them - 646-439-7920

[upstate650]

Everyone unhappy with HK should start by coding on the B&O option, then tweaking the sound from there. Much improved over HK. Still not amazing, but a nice improvement.

[TakeshiJin]

Originally Posted by upstate650

Everyone unhappy with HK should start by coding on the B&O option, then tweaking the sound from there. Much improved over HK. Still not amazing, but a nice improvement.

I am totally against coding in B&W AKA Bowers & Wilkins. People Stop calling it B&O (Bang & Olufsen) already; because it's not!

Anyways that aside. Bowers & Wilkins sound profiles definitely sound different and will have more profiles to expand the sound stage. However NONE of them except STUDIO is completely accurate due to the software coding and actual amp to channels to physical speakers configuration. If you use onstage it will use all 16 Channel in which the Harman Amp has only 10 in which only 9 are used (BMW Logic). When you change the Sound Stage from Studio to --> Onstage in the Bowers & Wilkins profile it's CLEARLY Underpowered and missing channels it will give you a surround effect at the cost of the music being heavily underwhelming in volume and it will have missing Frequencies due to the extra channels and physical speakers required.

So unless you're purely listening in STUDIO in Bowers & Wilkins it's not worth it.

Tweaking the EQ from the forums provided feedback / screenshot is the best way to listen with Logic 7 (Surround).

Other Options :

Cheap Solution : Swap out the subwoofers fixes your Bass needs.
$800 or $600 D.I.Y. :
2x Focal or Bavsound Subwoofers + Shop Install

Full Speaker solution
2-2.5k : For All 16 speakers replacement from Bavsound or Focal Speakers + Plus Shop Install Labor (a lot of door cards and speakers).

Full Solution = 4-4.5k : Requires Full Speaker Replacements + Match 10 DSP + AMP signal (Will be better then 80% of named Branded Systems out there excluding those Signature Reference Audio with ceiling / backrest speakers IE BMW B&W 4D Diamond, Meridian Reference Signature, Naim, ... etc)

[upstate650]

Originally Posted by TakeshiJin

I am totally against coding in B&W AKA Bowers & Wilkins. People Stop calling it B&O already; because it's not!

Anyways that aside. Bowers & Wilkins sound profiles definitely sound different and will have more profiles to expand the sound stage. However NONE of them except STUDIO is completely accurate due to the software coding and actual amp to channels to physical speakers configuration. If you use onstage it will use all 16 Channel in which the Harman Amp has only 10 in which only 9 are used (BMW Logic). When you change the Sound Stage from Studio to —> Onstage in the Bowers & Wilkins profile it's CLEARLY Underpowered and missing channels it will give you a surround effect at the cost of the music being heavily underpowered and plus it will have missing Frequencies period.

So unless you're purely listening in STUDIO in Bowers & Wilkins it's not worth it.

Tweaking the EQ from the forums provided feedback / screenshot is the best way to listen with Logic 7 (Surround).

Other Options :

Cheap Solution : Swap out the subwoofers fixes your Bass needs.
$800 $600 D.IY.
2x Focal or Bavsound Subwoofers + Shop Install

Speaker solution
2-2.5k For All 16 speakers replacement from Bavsound or Focal Speakers Plus Shop Install.

Full Solution = 4-4.5k : For Full Speaker Replacements + Match 10 DSP + AMP signal (Will be better then 80% of named Systems out there excluding those Signature Reference Audio with ceiling / backrest speakers IE BMW B&W 4D Diamond, Meridian Reference Signature, Naim, ... etc)

B&W yes, too many ampersands. I can’t keep them all straight. Anyway, that’s what I did. B&W, studio setting, push the fader a touch to the rear, and tweak the EQ a touch to my personal preference. It’s not amazing but it’s tolerable and better than anything I did in HK. And it was free. Something to think about if you aren’t happy with HK but don’t want to starting dropping big bucks on your stereo system.

[LarryMarcia]

Originally Posted by TakeshiJin

I am totally against coding in B&W AKA Bowers & Wilkins. People Stop calling it B&O already; because it's not!

Anyways that aside. Bowers & Wilkins sound profiles definitely sound different and will have more profiles to expand the sound stage. However NONE of them except STUDIO is completely accurate due to the software coding and actual amp to channels to physical speakers configuration. If you use onstage it will use all 16 Channel in which the Harman Amp has only 10 in which only 9 are used (BMW Logic). When you change the Sound Stage from Studio to --> Onstage in the Bowers & Wilkins profile it's CLEARLY Underpowered and missing channels it will give you a surround effect at the cost of the music being heavily underpowered and plus it will have missing Frequencies period.

So unless you're purely listening in STUDIO in Bowers & Wilkins it's not worth it.

Tweaking the EQ from the forums provided feedback / screenshot is the best way to listen with Logic 7 (Surround).

Other Options :

Cheap Solution : Swap out the subwoofers fixes your Bass needs.
$800 or $600 D.I.Y. :
2x Focal or Bavsound Subwoofers + Shop Install

Full Speaker solution
2-2.5k : For All 16 speakers replacement from Bavsound or Focal Speakers + Plus Shop Install Labor.

Full Solution = 4-4.5k : Requires Full Speaker Replacements + Match 10 DSP + AMP signal (Will be better then 80% of named Systems out there excluding those Signature Reference Audio with ceiling / backrest speakers IE BMW B&W 4D Diamond, Meridian Reference Signature, Naim, ... etc)

Your post should be a sticky as so many have discussed the issue of replacing the Harmon stereo on the BMW Three Series. What you say about potential upgrades is what the service / parts department recently told me at the dealership. I am just not ready to spend 4 grand and will live with the Harmon stereo until I have the extra funds. I am actually starting to feel a little better about the stereo, but maybe that is because I don't have the money to upgrade it!?

[MichaelNRW]

Has anyone already looked at the RAM module from the LCI?
It´s a little bit better compared to the PreLCI and maybe it´s an easy retrofit!

[Soul_Glo]

Originally Posted by MichaelNRW

Has anyone already looked at the RAM module from the LCI?
It´s a little bit better compared to the PreLCI and maybe it´s an easy retrofit!

Technic brother have you come across this? If they upgraded the power on lci and whether it can be hot swapped?

[LarryMarcia]

Thanks, any info from those that have swapped out the Harmon Kardon system from their G20 LCI would be appreciated.

[JITH]

In my opinion, reducing 1k all the way helps a lot to let bass and treble to have clear development for the rock, blues, jazz and pop music. Classic may need the 1k flat it to be better heard, IMO.

Try to diminish 1k and try to adjust the rest toward your liking. In almost every sound system I have had it works and HK isn't the exception.

Also, if Spotify is used, it allows you to equalize the output... If you mix both systems you might be surprised by the results.

Regards,

JI

[elambo]

Originally Posted by upstate650

Everyone unhappy with HK should start by coding on the B&O option, then tweaking the sound from there. Much improved over HK. Still not amazing, but a nice improvement.

All this does is unlock some parameter presets, but we've discovered settings which equal or surpass those so it's unnecessary to inject Bimmercode into the equation if it's not desired.

[elambo]

Originally Posted by Soul_Glo

Billfitz our resident fountain of knowledge. Is running/breaking in speakers a joke?!

Well, it's not a joke per se. In high end systems you'll hear improvements after a break-in period, but it requires articulate components, and only certain components will endure a break-in of any kind. Speaker drivers, for one. I haven't personally experienced any settling in my HK system over the year and a half I've had it, but auditory memory is horrible in humans (we begin to forget what we just heard mere seconds after the event occurs) so the likelihood of us truly sensing this in our HK systems is about zero.

I've experienced it in high end home systems. Speakers, in particular, will lose the edge in their high end over the course of a couple days. Sometimes more. I've experienced it with amps, too, but I'd rather not open Pandora's Box and start the argument.

These components may technically exhibit different properties over the course of a few days of playing but I'd be surprised if it's much. It's certainly not going to promote it from good to great.