[Montaver]

Originally Posted by toddwalton

Well, I’m in America and I remember the accolades that car got for its performance.

No one should sleep on or disrespect the 330i as something substandard when it exceeds standards BMW enthusiasts were thrilled with years ago. I don’t think that’s an unfair statement.

Who’s calling it sub standard? The 4 cylinder turbo with 2XXhp is ubiquitous across almost every brand. The B48 is a good all round engine, but there’s nothing particularly outstanding about it from an enthusiast perspective. I say that as someone who has driven 25k miles in a g20 330i. The game has massively moved on since performance cars had 250hp - you can buy a Toyota Camry with 300hp. To suggest that 250hp is ‘more than M3’s of old’ whilst in isolation is factually accurate doesn’t really tell much of a story.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by toddwalton

The point is that today’s 330i has performance superior to M3’s of the past and no one should be overlooking that.

So does a camry....

24 years is in fact aincent when talking about mass production cars with 6-7 year life cycles. Saying a 330i can outperform an m3 from 24 years ago is hardly surprising and honestly expected. I'm not here to say the 330i is a slouch, but using your logic to call it a beast is odd.

[M340I///M]

First off there is no such thing as a M330i there is a 330i with an M package not M performance let’s understand the two.

Comparing the 330i to a m340i is an insult! Especially considering that enthusiast would prefer the b58 engine and its M performance capabilities.

BMW placed a M on the 340i bagde for a reason. While it’s not a full M car the m340i trim level is closer to a M3 not a 330i….

stop trying to justify your 330i. And stop insulting the M340i

Unfortunately the 330i is the lowest trim level available for the 3 series. It’s in a category on its own. Where the M340i sits near and very close to an M3.

Just like Honda you have trim levels
Dx, lx, ex, ex-l , touring , si and type-r the engines go from 1.5 to as high as a 2.0

Do you compare a Honda SI to a Honda Type-r hell no ? One has a 1.5 and other has a 2.0 with different engine Internals (newer models) … two different animals and I owned both the 2015 si 205hp (2.0 ) and the 2017 type r (2.0) 306hp fk8 and a k24 you just can’t compare the two.

Just examples of different makes. As it does in the 2017 Honda Civic Type R, the turbo 2.0-liter makes 306 hp at 6,500 rpm and 295 lb-ft of torque from 2,500-4,500 rpm in crate engine form. The 2.4-liter si engine screams like a banshee on its way to its 7,000 rpm power peak of 205 ponies and 7,200 rpm redline. You don’t hear Honda enthusiast comparing to two why should we?

Same goes for the 330i and the m340i

Stop comparing them!

M package doesn’t mean M performance

For example my 2021 M340i has Adaptive M suspension, and adaptive M mode for damping road surface , 18” M performance bbk and track cooling package. M sport seats, M package. Shadowline package and extended shadowline , laser head lights not leds. While some of the options is how I had my individual BMW built some of these options aren’t available for the 330i.

Let’s face it ( and I came from a 330i so I have experience with both and the 330i is a snail to say it’s powerful is laughable I hated the 330i power but loved its simplicity…

Again not bashing the 330i owners just trying to help you understand that the two aren’t comparable.


Do yourself a favor and test drive a M340i then come back and edit your post. I’ll wait…… because it’s night and day.

Night lads

[TTG]

I am going to chime in as I am one of the minorities on this board as I don't track my cars, modify them heavily (only OEM + type of things) or looking to be the fastest car.

330 is a great car, if you want to drive a BMW everyday, it is a great car if you are not a "car person" and it is a great car for anyone that is not about little things.

IMO M340 is all about the little things. It goes a little faster, it handles a little better, it sounds really good and it does everything better overall. So if you care about those little things, go for M340, if you are looking to impress people, just own / drive a BMW and not care about little extras, there is nothing wrong with a 330.

Also, we are super spoiled in the US with these higher end BMW models. Most of the world is driving cars like 320i or 320e and 330 alone would be considered a huge upgrade for some of the world.

There is nothing wrong with either but if you can afford it and appreciate the little things, go with a M340. To this date, it is my absolute most fav BMW I have ever owned and trust me, I have owned many of them!

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by JUNIOR302

Unfortunately the 330i is the lowest trim level available for the 3 series. It’s in a category on its own. Where the M340i sits near and very close to an M3.

Actually 330i is not the lowest trim level for G20, it is the 320i(which also has a 181HP B48).

For sure M340i@382HP is 127HP more than 330i@255HP.

On the other hand, M340i is not that close to base M3@473HP, M3 competition@510HP, and M3 CS@550HP.

[toddwalton]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

24 years is in fact aincent when talking about mass production cars with 6-7 year life cycles. Saying a 330i can outperform an m3 from 24 years ago is hardly surprising and honestly expected. I'm not here to say the 330i is a slouch, but using your logic to call it a beast is odd.

The roads didn’t change, the speed limits didn’t change, the human body hasn’t changed, if we’re looking at the reaction of drivers to the E36 M3’s power back in the day as something extremely favorable (it was) then the G20 330i exceeds it. That’s not a knock on the M340i at all. It’s simply more powerful. However, that doesn’t make the 330i a weakling. Quite the opposite. It’s delivering M3 levels of performance.

This is something BMW enthusiasts in a 3 Series forum should be proud of. Not sure why some think it’s objectionable.

[sfgator]

Originally Posted by toddwalton

The 330i is a rocket, it’s got M3 levels of power from years ago, it’s no slouch at all. The 340i just takes it up another level, that’s all, and most of us don’t need it. Don’t feel like the 330i is some let down. It’s a beast.

We don’t need it, we want it!

[toddwalton]

Originally Posted by sfgator

We don’t need it, we want it!

And you shall have it! In fact, we all can, it’s not like we can’t afford it.

The 330i is not something to be looked down upon because some decide they can’t take advantage of the extra power, that’s all. As brothers, 330 and 340 are Beast and Beast Plus.

[zoso4534]

Originally Posted by toddwalton

The 330i is a rocket, it’s got M3 levels of power from years ago, it’s no slouch at all. The 340i just takes it up another level, that’s all, and most of us don’t need it. Don’t feel like the 330i is some let down. It’s a beast.

Agree, 330i is a beast in Sport mode.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by toddwalton

The roads didn’t change, the speed limits didn’t change, the human body hasn’t changed, if we’re looking at the reaction of drivers to the E36 M3’s power back in the day as something extremely favorable (it was) then the G20 330i exceeds it. That’s not a knock on the M340i at all. It’s simply more powerful. However, that doesn’t make the 330i a weakling. Quite the opposite. It’s delivering M3 levels of performance.

This is something BMW enthusiasts in a 3 Series forum should be proud of. Not sure why some think it’s objectionable.

Actually to some degree all those things have changed. But that's besides the point. You know what's changed the most? Literally all cars. Case in point a Toyota Camry, something synonymous with a boring everyday family sedan, exceeds the performance of an M3 from 24 years ago.

Again, I'm not saying the 330i is a slouch, it's a great car. But saying it outperforms an m3 from 24 years ago is like saying I'm 24 years older than I was 24 years ago.... no shit. It's not a remarkable achievement... it's to be expected.


Now on to the subject matter - as a former m340i owner, I definitely think the m340i is well worth the upgrade over the 330i. I never tracked that car, but the m340i also isn't a track car. Its a road car and you absolutely feel the difference on the road. The b58 is an absolute gem of an engine and worth every penny in my book.

[Davg31]

Originally Posted by toddwalton

2023 330i has 255 horsepower, 295 pound-feet of torque and does 0-60 in 5.4 seconds.

1999 M3 had 240 horsepower, 236 pound feet of torque and a 0-60 time of 6.2 seconds.

Not satire at all. The E36 M3 is a legendary BMW. And a modern 330i is faster. And at the same time, larger and more comfortable.

In your logic, so much faster than a Bugatti from 1930 :=) or a Ferrari from the 70's, we have to compare it to our times.

[Davg31]

Originally Posted by toddwalton

The roads didn’t change, the speed limits didn’t change, the human body hasn’t changed, if we’re looking at the reaction of drivers to the E36 M3’s power back in the day as something extremely favorable (it was) then the G20 330i exceeds it. That’s not a knock on the M340i at all. It’s simply more powerful. However, that doesn’t make the 330i a weakling. Quite the opposite. It’s delivering M3 levels of performance.

This is something BMW enthusiasts in a 3 Series forum should be proud of. Not sure why some think it’s objectionable.

You're not taking the question in the right direction, the question is 330 vs M340 stop your comparison out of time and having no interest in the initial question, as I mentioned my 430 was fabulous, for normal driving, without looking for sensation, if not too sanitized (incomparable to the feeling of an E36) the M340 is so much more, it is an M3 in ball dress, not in sportswear.

[Davg31]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

Actually 330i is not the lowest trim level for G20, it is the 320i(which also has a 181HP B48).

No 318 it's little y thinks 154 HP

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by Davg31

No 318 it's little y thinks 154 HP

Yeah the the G20 318d with B47 diesel has 148HP, and 0-60 in 8.2seconds.

So 330i is right at the middle of the G20 lineup to support the center stage effect.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by Davg31

the M340 is so much more, it is an M3 in ball dress, not in sportswear.

To use BMW's marketing terms, the M340 is the "athlete", or "Road-ready vehicles enhanced with the epic engineering of BMW M". That means the M340i and 330i are in the same category as road-ready vehicles, with the same WBA prefix(if made in Germany).

The M3, on the other hand, is the "powerhouse", or "Legendary vehicles fully developed and engineered for performance-obsessed drivers", with WBS prefix to prove it.


So according to BMW, M340i and M3 are 2 different cars for 2 different types of buyers.

[monkeyman8]

I went 340 because of the B58. Fabulous engine, will never track and race. It does everything really well. Probably the best value proposition for a luxury sports sedan. 330 was never an option.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

Actually to some degree all those things have changed. But that's besides the point. You know what's changed the most? Literally all cars. Case in point a Toyota Camry, something synonymous with a boring everyday family sedan, exceeds the performance of an M3 from 24 years ago.

I used top-trim Camry/Accord as a reference to compare with my previous E39 530i and F30 328i, and those BMWs are 15% extra car for 30% price premiums.

When I bought my 2021 G20 330i, those numbers flipped, namely the top-trim Accord(with markups!) was 5% more expensive than 330i, while the 330i was 30% more car than Accord.

I don't know what is the current price trends, but I tend to agree with post#1's article that 95% of the time the 330i feels exactly the same as driving a M340i, so I would still pick 330i over the M340i.

[M340I///M]

Originally Posted by JUNIOR302

Unfortunately the 330i is the lowest trim level available for the 3 series. It’s in a category on its own. Where the M340i sits near and very close to an M3.

Actually 330i is not the lowest trim level for G20, it is the 320i(which also has a 181HP B48).

For sure M340i@382HP is 127HP more than 330i@255HP.

On the other hand, M340i is not that close to base M3@473HP, M3 competition@510HP, and M3 CS@550HP.

Touché! I don’t argue about these things I simply give you my point of view. I simply give you what I believe not what others believe non of our opinions matter but to ourselves . I’m not a BMW engineer, but I’m also not ignorant to the facts.

Happy New years too all

Drive safe everyone

[EXE46]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

To use BMW's marketing terms, the M340 is the "athlete", or "Road-ready vehicles enhanced with the epic engineering of BMW M". That means the M340i and 330i are in the same category as road-ready vehicles, with the same WBA prefix(if made in Germany).

The M3, on the other hand, is the "powerhouse", or "Legendary vehicles fully developed and engineered for performance-obsessed drivers", with WBS prefix to prove it.


So according to BMW, M340i and M3 are 2 different cars for 2 different types of buyers.

Does one really need to emphasize this? The 330i is no substitute for the M340i and conversely the M340i is no substitute for someone looking for an M3. I mean, this is the same forum where people who buys an M340i are looking for Lexus-like ride qualities and are literally crying that the ride is too harsh. Something you'll never see on the G8X subforum's.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by EXE46

Does one really need to emphasize this? The 330i is no substitute for the M340i and conversely the M340i is no substitute for someone looking for an M3. I mean, this is the same forum where people who buys an M340i are looking for Lexus-like ride qualities and are literally crying that the ride is too harsh. Something you'll never see on the G8X subforum's.

Agreed, 330i, M340i, and M3 are 3 products for 3 different segments.

One poster(with long-term E46 and E90 experiences) in fact moved from G20 M340i back to F30 340i M-sport due to M340i's harsh ride, so each of us is looking for specific things that fit our requirements.

I would think G8X subforum posters likely have thorough knowledge of the G8X ride qualities before buying those products, or maybe folks just trade in their harsh rides quietly.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

Agreed, 330i, M340i, and M3 are 3 products for 3 different segments.

One poster(with long-term E46 and E90 experiences) in fact moved from G20 M340i back to F30 340i M-sport due to M340i's harsh ride, so each of us is looking for specific things that fit our requirements.

I would think G8X subforum posters likely have thorough knowledge of the G8X ride qualities before buying those products, or maybe folks just trade in their harsh rides quietly.

G8x actually rides much better than stock m340i suspension. EDC on the m3 is really good, so much so that whereas my wife refused to ride in the m340i, she's more willing to ride in the m3.

[j2dad5389]

I think it would make sense for an m340 vs m3. The m3 is just way more car than the roads legally allow. The m340 is perfect!