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      02-11-2019, 06:27 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by auggiem3 View Post
Wow - that's the first I've heard of a timeline that early. Scott - are you saying US customer car deliveries on the G80 M3 in mid 2020? May/June/July?
I assume that means an 03/2020 SOP for the G80 M3 with cars arriving late April/early May.
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      02-11-2019, 07:06 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSBM5 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by auggiem3 View Post
Wow - that's the first I've heard of a timeline that early. Scott - are you saying US customer car deliveries on the G80 M3 in mid 2020? May/June/July?
I assume that means an 03/2020 SOP for the G80 M3 with cars arriving late April/early May.
Sounds right based on the delivery window in 15 months.

I'd like to clarify and hear more on the timeline from Scott given his position as an insider.
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      02-11-2019, 08:59 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by auggiem3 View Post
Sounds right based on the delivery window in 15 months.

I'd like to clarify and hear more on the timeline from Scott given his position as an insider.
I would too. If true, it looks like the G20 will be here about 1 year earlier than the "normal" 7-year cycle would dictate. Also, I assume BMWNA is going to call these 2021 M3s like they normally do with March SOP models.
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      02-11-2019, 09:01 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSBM5 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by auggiem3 View Post
Sounds right based on the delivery window in 15 months.

I'd like to clarify and hear more on the timeline from Scott given his position as an insider.
I would too. If true, it looks like the G20 will be here about 1 year earlier than the "normal" 7-year cycle would dictate. Also, I assume BMWNA is going to call these 2021 M3s like they normally do with March SOP models.
Same here - cautiously optimistic on a staggered M3/M4 release diverging from the 7 year cycle.
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      02-11-2019, 01:28 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSBM5 View Post
I would too. If true, it looks like the G20 will be here about 1 year earlier than the "normal" 7-year cycle would dictate. Also, I assume BMWNA is going to call these 2021 M3s like they normally do with March SOP models.
This makes sense... the "2020" M340 is going into production in march.... right alongside the 2019 330.

Can see no reason why the 2021 M3 couldnt go into production alongside the 2020 M340 and 330 next spring??

With all the testing going on and mules we have seen, the only reason for a delay i could see is if they decided to repeat the F80/F82 and have the M3 and M4 share a facia. In that case they wouldnt want the M3 to give away the 4/M4 before they are shown.
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      02-11-2019, 04:45 PM   #28
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Choice (10) M8- should be available when your lease is up.
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      02-11-2019, 04:59 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xlover View Post
With all the testing going on and mules we have seen, the only reason for a delay i could see is if they decided to repeat the F80/F82 and have the M3 and M4 share a facia. In that case they wouldnt want the M3 to give away the 4/M4 before they are shown.
I expect BMW AG is going to wait until the F33/83 EOP - 10/2020. Too many shared parts between the M3/M4, as an earlier G80 release would cannibalize F82/F83 and possibly X3M/X4M sales. The G80 is the lowest entry price point, by delaying market release, the built-up customer demand will justify MRSP pricing, similar to the M2. Cars.com lists new 579 M3's for sale and new 614 M4's for sale.
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      02-11-2019, 08:58 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibiza View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by xlover View Post
With all the testing going on and mules we have seen, the only reason for a delay i could see is if they decided to repeat the F80/F82 and have the M3 and M4 share a facia. In that case they wouldnt want the M3 to give away the 4/M4 before they are shown.
I expect BMW AG is going to wait until the F80/82/83 EOP 10/2020. Too many shared parts between the M3/M4, as an earlier G80 release would cannibalize F82/F83 and possibly X3M/X4M sales. The G80 is the lowest entry price point, by delaying market release, the built-up customer demand will justify MRSP pricing, similar to the M2. Cars.com lists new 579 M3's for sale and new 614 M4's for sale.
I get the logic there, however they must realize as the M cars have gone more mainstream they are leaving a hole in the lineup as customers want to turn over their vehicles (or have to for leases).

I guess I am not arguing that delaying it to build demand isn't a legitimate strategy, I would argue it's probably not the right one anymore. Considering the number of mules we have seen testing so early and for so long car must be close to ready.
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      02-12-2019, 06:40 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibiza View Post
I expect BMW AG is going to wait until the F33/83 EOP - 10/2020. Too many shared parts between the M3/M4, as an earlier G80 release would cannibalize F82/F83 and possibly X3M/X4M sales. The G80 is the lowest entry price point, by delaying market release, the built-up customer demand will justify MRSP pricing, similar to the M2. Cars.com lists new 579 M3's for sale and new 614 M4's for sale.
From elsewhere my understanding is that the new X3M will be the first to get the S58 engine. The G80 M3 will follow thereafter and likely exactly on the timeline SCOTT26 mentioned (given he knows the actual schedule). The whole time the F82/3 M4 will remain in production with its S55 until the slated EOP. Apparently BMW is trying to "decouple" the M4 from the M3 product line in these sense you're referring to here.
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      02-12-2019, 06:54 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSBM5 View Post
From elsewhere my understanding is that the new X3M will be the first to get the S58 engine. The G80 M3 will follow thereafter and likely exactly on the timeline SCOTT26 mentioned (given he knows the actual schedule). The whole time the F82/3 M4 will remain in production with its S55 until the slated EOP. Apparently BMW is trying to "decouple" the M4 from the M3 product line in these sense you're referring to here.
Correct about the S58, as a retired M product and developement engineer confirmed this to me, October 2018.

I will be at the BMW Winter Test Center (Arjeplog) latter this month for 5 days of ice training and will inquire.
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      02-12-2019, 10:16 AM   #33
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'Should i lease?'

Yikes, that's a no fam. After 2 lease cycles of a 328i you are already $5k poorer then the guy who bought and sold one, and that's assuming you're not over miles and the car is perfect.

Buying new is actually cheaper assuming it doesn't depreciation bomb like an i3 for example and assuming you keep it for 5 years.

Go buy a used 911 or used i8 or something fun and enjoy your extra money with some track days or a Miata or something.
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      02-12-2019, 10:20 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSBM5 View Post
From elsewhere my understanding is that the new X3M will be the first to get the S58 engine. The G80 M3 will follow thereafter and likely exactly on the timeline SCOTT26 mentioned (given he knows the actual schedule). The whole time the F82/3 M4 will remain in production with its S55 until the slated EOP. Apparently BMW is trying to "decouple" the M4 from the M3 product line in these sense you're referring to here.
I'm assuming they like the current 5 and 6 series scenario. Some people will buy the 6 to hold them over til the new 6. Others will buy the 5 waiting fo the 8 and then trade it early and buy again when the 8 finally arrives.

BMW preying on impulse buyers
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      02-12-2019, 11:24 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PureModelsOnly View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by SleepingBMW View Post
Buying new is actually cheaper assuming it doesn't depreciation bomb like an i3 for example and assuming you keep it for 5 years.
M cars are depreciation bombs. Look how many new ones still for sale especially the CS which is now being discounted. I'd only only lease M cars.
You realize a lease is by definition financing the cost of depreciation. Whatever the car you lease BMW finance treats it like a loan on the value of depreciation. Then they charged you 14% interest on that value plus mileage and damage and some extra profit. (Cost of capitol is only .0001%!!! What a deal!)
That's why the M5 has a huge lease cost.

If you buy the M5 and sell it in 5 years YOU WILL have more money than if you leased. Even if you financed. You eat the depreciation yes, but you then sell the car and have all that money back. With a lease you pay higher interests on the depreciation then let BMW sell the car and keep the rest. It's hilariously stupid financially. You really think BMW is letting you outsmart them?

You ever watch BMW commercials? They always end it with LEASE NOW FOR $X99 a month. Wha-? Why not just market the MSRP is the vehicle? Could it be? They make more money off leases? So much in fact they can spend millions on advertising campaigns to encourage more people to lease?

Well, no, you're probably right nm. I see that leases have a smaller monthly payment. You definitely outsmarted that company with record profits that pushes leases. Poor bastards got stuck with your car after the lease, and it depreciated more than a Camry!

Imagine if they found a way to profit off of that depreciation? They could be rich! Anyway, I'm going to go sell my M5 for a lease on a new one. Wouldn't want to have to pay for a spark plug change out of pocket. BMWs are so unreliable defiantly lease them or you'll spend so much in repairs!!
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      02-13-2019, 12:40 PM   #36
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Then they charged you 14% interest on that value plus mileage and damage and some extra profit. (Cost of capitol is only .0001%!!! What a deal!)
That's why the M5 has a huge lease cost.
Current MF is 0.00188 which is 4.5% interest. The M5 only has a 55% RV. The M3 has 61% with more program support.

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      02-13-2019, 12:45 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmg View Post
Current MF is 0.00188 which is 4.5% interest. The M5 only has a 55% RV. The M3 has 61% with more program support.

What do you drive?
Yeah leasing doesn't make sense unless the residuals are in the 60's and unfortunately the days of 62% to 64% seem to be over. I may continue to purchase some gently used M's moving forward. I'd never purchase a new M outright for that first 2-3 year depreciation hit.
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      02-13-2019, 04:09 PM   #38
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porsche - why are you even asking us? :P
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      02-14-2019, 01:01 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmg View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by SleepingBMW View Post
Then they charged you 14% interest on that value plus mileage and damage and some extra profit. (Cost of capitol is only .0001%!!! What a deal!)
That's why the M5 has a huge lease cost.
Current MF is 0.00188 which is 4.5% interest. The M5 only has a 55% RV. The M3 has 61% with more program support.

What do you drive?
M5
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      02-14-2019, 01:26 PM   #40
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M5
The 2018 M5 is more attractive as a lease than the 2019 M5. The 2019 M5 is best done as a purchase. Review the M3/M4 or M3 CS leases and you might come up with a better scenario for leasing. Of course, this is contingent on getting a new car in 3 years. M4 CS does not lease as well.
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      02-14-2019, 01:26 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmg View Post
Current MF is 0.00188 which is 4.5% interest. The M5 only has a 55% RV. The M3 has 61% with more program support.

What do you drive?
I believe the M5 is down to 50% right now. I just looked into one and they are brutal to lease. Unless the 18 is 55%, which still sucks.
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