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      02-11-2019, 01:15 AM   #111
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      02-11-2019, 08:00 AM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 440xiGCMSport2 View Post
while this generation tail lights might look like a Lexus it still looks better than the e90 rear lights which looked like it came off a Kia. In my opinion the e90 was the worst looking 3er. It looked like some Korean corean when I first saw it. yes it drove wonderfully. The new 3er still is an attractive car when you compare it to the c-class and A4 so I am willing to bet most will lease or buy another me despite some of the criticism. not every 3er will be as attractive as the e46.
Be happy that BMW did a better job of it than they did with the 5er and 7serires. They really screwed the design of those vehicles.
Lol at your 5 and 7 series comment.
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      02-11-2019, 09:38 AM   #113
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I have no idea how people look at this car, and hate so aggressively.
We are in a global mental breakdown.

Also, I've been in this forum for 8 years, almost every single new car thread had these:
"BMW lost it"
"Looks like Camry/Kia/Accord"
"I'll go check on Audi, MB or something"
...
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      02-11-2019, 09:48 AM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DML View Post
How about actually "driving" like the e30?? BMW has become the rest, way too looks oriented, too much tech, while neglecting the ole slogan "ultimate driving machine". Disappointing...Please don't give me that garbage "change is good".
Driving like E30? Did you have drive a E30?
It drives like an SUV if you compare it to the new cars. Leans right and left in every corner, leans front and back every time you break, no sound to speak of, breaks are "from another era". One can make the argument that steering is better. Sure, I guess. But that's about it.
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      02-11-2019, 09:54 AM   #115
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Originally Posted by DML View Post
How about actually "driving" like the e30?? BMW has become the rest, way too looks oriented, too much tech, while neglecting the ole slogan "ultimate driving machine". Disappointing...Please don't give me that garbage "change is good".
I don't think they ever neglected the slogan "ultimate driving machine".
First of all that's a marketing slogan. Second of all, literally every review that came out of this car praised its driving dynamics. In addition, 2 series, 5 series, 7 series, new 8 series, and even X cars have all been praised about being 'fun to drive' when compared with competition. So obviously they deserve their slogan that they don't need to 'deserve' as it's a marketing slogan.
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      02-11-2019, 10:11 AM   #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cortexiphan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by DML View Post
How about actually "driving" like the e30?? BMW has become the rest, way too looks oriented, too much tech, while neglecting the ole slogan "ultimate driving machine". Disappointing...Please don't give me that garbage "change is good".
I don't think they ever neglected the slogan "ultimate driving machine".
First of all that's a marketing slogan. Second of all, literally every review that came out of this car praised its driving dynamics. In addition, 2 series, 5 series, 7 series, new 8 series, and even X cars have all been praised about being 'fun to drive' when compared with competition. So obviously they deserve their slogan that they don't need to 'deserve' as it's a marketing slogan.
Do you work for BMW???

Are you on the design team of the latest monstrosities to come out of Munich?

I'll simplify for you

BMWs used to be a step above in many categories that car enthusiasts cared about.

Now they make mommy mobile SUVs, grandpa sedans, and Lexus's that look like shit.

If they didn't have ///M I and many others would be gone. Even that's barely holding on with ///M sport garbage
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      02-11-2019, 11:37 AM   #117
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Thumbs down

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drj161 View Post
Why are all the signature BMW character lines messed up? No line running through the door handles, and a regular hockey stick line? G30 and g01 were one of the last new BMW to stick to tradition. Everything new is
No line running through the door handles

I agree on this, this is one of the best design features of a BMW and they got rid of this, horrible new designers....7 series grill looks like a citybus...dont know if I would get a BMW as my next car if these crazy crap designs continue...current M4 and 4 series, 8 series look posh...that should be the baseline for all new designs..
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      02-11-2019, 01:51 PM   #118
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The G20 looks so much more modern when standing next to the G30. Definitely can't wait to see what the G80 will look like.
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      02-11-2019, 02:08 PM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M4ster Yoda View Post
Do you work for BMW???

Are you on the design team of the latest monstrosities to come out of Munich?

I'll simplify for you

BMWs used to be a step above in many categories that car enthusiasts cared about.

Now they make mommy mobile SUVs, grandpa sedans, and Lexus's that look like shit.

If they didn't have ///M I and many others would be gone. Even that's barely holding on with ///M sport garbage
No I'm not working for the design team, and I don't need simplification. Let me simplify for you, since judging by how you started your post by a personal attack, you need simplification.

"BMWs used to be a step above in many categories that car enthusiasts cared about. " When was that? Actually that's now. Maybe E46 era looks strong mostly because of the lack of competition at that time, but even at that time this type of people were all around the place... I remember E46 M3 release. Everybody was complaining it lost its soul, became a GT, and that ESC didn't have a place in M3 (E36 didn't have ESC) blah blah blah. E90 came out (Worst 3 series sedan design in and out IMO) and E92 M3 was "too soft", E90 design was so bland it was like Kia, turbo didn't have place in BMWs, blah blah blah.

Right now, BMWs are a step above in many not all categories that car enthusiasts care about. Does any one have any doubt that this 3 series will be better to drive than C300 or A4 2.0T? Every single review from people who have SEEN and DRIVEN the car are saying that G20 is better than competition especially for driving enthusiasts. The same goes to 'Mummy SUVs'. X1, X3, X5 are all better than competition in terms of driving dynamics; same goes to 5 series and 7 series, those "granpa sedans". And if you're bothered by the fact that BMW is making SUVs, you'll have a very hard time finding a competitior who doesn't make one. Heck, even Ferrari will introduce an SUV this year. BMWs 4 pot engine, inline-6 engine are way ahead of competition as well.

What car appeals to 'enthusiast' more than 2 series in its class? Mercedes A class? Audi A3? Is C class better to drive than this G20? Is E class or A6 better to drive than 5 series? Is S class better to drove than 7? Is GLA or Q5 better than X3? Let me answer in order: None, NO, NO, NO. Actually, almost all non-M BMWs are faster and more fun to drive than competitiors according to all reviews, whereas leaving aside M2, M cars are not always ahead, since in terms of engine & performance & driving dynamics; E63S AMG vs M5 is debatable, M4 vs Alfa romeo Quadrifoglio is debatable, Porsche Cayenne Turbo vs X5M is debatable, but 530i vs E300 is not; 330i vs Alfa R Gulio is not, X5 40i vs Cayenne V6 is not.

What's exactly your source of your very uninformed agressive cynicism?
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      02-11-2019, 02:09 PM   #120
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I like the g20 size.. now I can't wait for g80!
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      02-11-2019, 02:19 PM   #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cortexiphan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M4ster Yoda View Post
Do you work for BMW???

Are you on the design team of the latest monstrosities to come out of Munich?

I'll simplify for you

BMWs used to be a step above in many categories that car enthusiasts cared about.

Now they make mommy mobile SUVs, grandpa sedans, and Lexus's that look like shit.

If they didn't have ///M I and many others would be gone. Even that's barely holding on with ///M sport garbage
No I'm not working for the design team, and I don't need simplification. Let me simplify for you, since judging by how you started your post by a personal attack, you need simplification.

"BMWs used to be a step above in many categories that car enthusiasts cared about. " When was that? Actually that's now. Maybe E46 era looks strong mostly because of the lack of competition at that time, but even at that time this type of people were all around the place... I remember E46 M3 release. Everybody was complaining it lost its soul, became a GT, and that ESC didn't have a place in M3 (E36 didn't have ESC) blah blah blah. E90 came out (Worst 3 series sedan design in and out IMO) and E92 M3 was "too soft", E90 design was so bland it was like Kia, turbo didn't have place in BMWs, blah blah blah.

Right now, BMWs are a step above in many not all categories that car enthusiasts care about. Does any one have any doubt that this 3 series will be better to drive than C300 or A4 2.0T? Every single review from people who have SEEN and DRIVEN the car are saying that G20 is better than competition especially for driving enthusiasts. The same goes to 'Mummy SUVs'. X1, X3, X5 are all better than competition in terms of driving dynamics; same goes to 5 series and 7 series, those "granpa sedans". And if you're bothered by the fact that BMW is making SUVs, you'll have a very hard time finding a competitior who doesn't make one. Heck, even Ferrari will introduce an SUV this year. BMWs 4 pot engine, inline-6 engine are way ahead of competition as well.

What car appeals to 'enthusiast' more than 2 series in its class? Mercedes A class? Audi A3? Is C class better to drive than this G20? Is E class or A6 better to drive than 5 series? Is S class better to drove than 7? Is GLA or Q5 better than X3? Let me answer in order: None, NO, NO, NO. Actually, almost all non-M BMWs are faster and more fun to drive than competitiors according to all reviews, whereas leaving aside M2, M cars are not always ahead, since in terms of engine & performance & driving dynamics; E63S AMG vs M5 is debatable, M4 vs Alfa romeo Quadrifoglio is debatable, Porsche Cayenne Turbo vs X5M is debatable, but 530i vs E300 is not; 330i vs Alfa R Gulio is not, X5 40i vs Cayenne V6 is not.

What's exactly your source of your very uninformed agressive cynicism?
sorry the 7 series is not better than the S class. maybe in driving dynamics but that isn't the main objective in those cars. The S class has always been better and sales show it. Better design, better riding and better interior.
May not have better dynamics but when cruising about or down a highway the S class is tough to beat. New S class will most likely put it back on top.
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      02-11-2019, 02:23 PM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 440xiGCMSport2 View Post
sorry the 7 series is not better than the S class. maybe in driving dynamics but that isn't the main objective in those cars. The S class has always been better and sales show it. Better design, better riding and better interior.
May not have better dynamics but when cruising about or down a highway the S class is tough to beat. New S class will most likely put it back on top.
I'm talking about driving dynamics, as I've mentioned.
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      02-11-2019, 02:37 PM   #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 530iDriver View Post
I think the BMW-Toyota alliance has unofficially touched the G20...
I'm sure G20 design was finalized years before that.
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      02-11-2019, 02:41 PM   #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cortexiphan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by 440xiGCMSport2 View Post
sorry the 7 series is not better than the S class. maybe in driving dynamics but that isn't the main objective in those cars. The S class has always been better and sales show it. Better design, better riding and better interior.
May not have better dynamics but when cruising about or down a highway the S class is tough to beat. New S class will most likely put it back on top.
I'm talking about driving dynamics, as I've mentioned.
I agreed with you on dynamics. I am just pointing out people rarely buy these 2 cars on dynamics. Usually buy for refinement and ride. So the dynamic advantage you pointed out is actually a disadvantage.
I don't think anyone is complaining about the driving dynamics of the new car as no one has driven one yet. They are complaining about design language.
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      02-11-2019, 03:16 PM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 530iDriver View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by 440xiGCMSport2 View Post
while this generation tail lights might look like a Lexus it still looks better than the e90 rear lights which looked like it came off a Kia. In my opinion the e90 was the worst looking 3er. It looked like some Korean corean when I first saw it. yes it drove wonderfully. The new 3er still is an attractive car when you compare it to the c-class and A4 so I am willing to bet most will lease or buy another me despite some of the criticism. not every 3er will be as attractive as the e46.
Be happy that BMW did a better job of it than they did with the 5er and 7serires. They really screwed the design of those vehicles.
Lol at your 5 and 7 series comment.
Well that is my opinion like it or not. Some agree some don't.
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      02-11-2019, 03:17 PM   #126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 440xiGCMSport2 View Post
I agreed with you on dynamics. I am just pointing out people rarely buy these 2 cars on dynamics. Usually buy for refinement and ride. So the dynamic advantage you pointed out is actually a disadvantage.
I don't think anyone is complaining about the driving dynamics of the new car as no one has driven one yet. They are complaining about design language.
If you look at the message that I've replied to, it says:
"BMWs used to be a step above in many categories that car enthusiasts cared about. " Then he goes on to "SUVs and grandpa sedans"
He's talking about driving fun, enthusiast stuff, and I'm replying to him.
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      02-11-2019, 03:47 PM   #127
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I remember when the Bangle E60 came out...Oh the howls of sacrilege and turning their back on classic BMW lines.

Now people pine for E60 lol

Never will please everybody. Final verdict will be the upcoming sales figures.
E60 has many elements of the 5 series even if it's hidden behind bangle-isms. As a result the car has aged extremely well imo. Looks like it could be in the line up today (and be best looking!).

In fact most of those bangle era cars aged pretty well IMO. Granted they sort of created the design trends that most copied going forward so that helps.

Right now it's like Audi is the class leader for design and everyone is trying to do cool day time running lights and angles to make it look mean and angry. All stems from the R8 as far as I can tell.

Another example, the bangle Z4s and the Z8. They have 507 lines as the foundation and then added the new design elements over them similair to the 911 approach.

The new Z4 is Adrian Van Hooeydonk attempting to make BMW design HIS design without respect towards BMW design. It has no foundation in BMW history, more like KIA history.

Basically what I'm saying is designs like e60 and e42 have their foundations solid and are solid many years later as a result.

The new designs are very trendy and have a very agressive look very novel but it will âge worse than a Nissan Cube. They even killed angel eyes for the new Van Hooeydonk 'L' things. I suspect this is supposed to look like an 'angry' angel eye where the top of the circle is cut off by the angry narrowed eyelid.

AGGRESSIVE SUPER FAST F'ING 320i RACE MACHINE. It look good to Leasers, but these will be remembered as 996 fried egg Porsches in 10 years. It's ugly and flies in the face of classic design.
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      02-11-2019, 04:05 PM   #128
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[...] these will be remembered as 996 fried egg Porsches in 10 years. [...]
Just like these comments.

Wow, it's liberating seeing 10 years into the future.
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      02-11-2019, 05:18 PM   #129
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Lots of meh's.

*starts E36*
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      02-11-2019, 05:24 PM   #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cortexiphan View Post
No I'm not working for the design team, and I don't need simplification. Let me simplify for you, since judging by how you started your post by a personal attack, you need simplification.

"BMWs used to be a step above in many categories that car enthusiasts cared about. " When was that? Actually that's now. Maybe E46 era looks strong mostly because of the lack of competition at that time, but even at that time this type of people were all around the place... I remember E46 M3 release. Everybody was complaining it lost its soul, became a GT, and that ESC didn't have a place in M3 (E36 didn't have ESC) blah blah blah. E90 came out (Worst 3 series sedan design in and out IMO) and E92 M3 was "too soft", E90 design was so bland it was like Kia, turbo didn't have place in BMWs, blah blah blah.

Right now, BMWs are a step above in many not all categories that car enthusiasts care about. Does any one have any doubt that this 3 series will be better to drive than C300 or A4 2.0T? Every single review from people who have SEEN and DRIVEN the car are saying that G20 is better than competition especially for driving enthusiasts. The same goes to 'Mummy SUVs'. X1, X3, X5 are all better than competition in terms of driving dynamics; same goes to 5 series and 7 series, those "granpa sedans". And if you're bothered by the fact that BMW is making SUVs, you'll have a very hard time finding a competitior who doesn't make one. Heck, even Ferrari will introduce an SUV this year. BMWs 4 pot engine, inline-6 engine are way ahead of competition as well.

What car appeals to 'enthusiast' more than 2 series in its class? Mercedes A class? Audi A3? Is C class better to drive than this G20? Is E class or A6 better to drive than 5 series? Is S class better to drove than 7? Is GLA or Q5 better than X3? Let me answer in order: None, NO, NO, NO. Actually, almost all non-M BMWs are faster and more fun to drive than competitiors according to all reviews, whereas leaving aside M2, M cars are not always ahead, since in terms of engine & performance & driving dynamics; E63S AMG vs M5 is debatable, M4 vs Alfa romeo Quadrifoglio is debatable, Porsche Cayenne Turbo vs X5M is debatable, but 530i vs E300 is not; 330i vs Alfa R Gulio is not, X5 40i vs Cayenne V6 is not.

What's exactly your source of your very uninformed agressive cynicism?
Uniformed? Haha. Not

FYI. I wasn't trying to attack you. I was really just messing around being a wise ass. You seemed very worked up about the criticism of the new Lexus's (BMWs) and I was just adding fuel to the fire
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      02-11-2019, 08:30 PM   #131
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      02-11-2019, 09:37 PM   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cortexiphan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by DML View Post
How about actually "driving" like the e30?? BMW has become the rest, way too looks oriented, too much tech, while neglecting the ole slogan "ultimate driving machine". Disappointing...Please don't give me that garbage "change is good".
Driving like E30? Did you have drive a E30?
It drives like an SUV if you compare it to the new cars. Leans right and left in every corner, leans front and back every time you break, no sound to speak of, breaks are "from another era". One can make the argument that steering is better. Sure, I guess. But that's about it.
Here I'll make you feel better, BMW manufacturers an absolute perfect automobile, each & every model is the staple of what a finely German car should aspire to be. How does the best keep getting better? Truly amazing
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