[Boosted6]

I tried to get an answer from them on tuning unlocked cars.
It seems like they just won't do it , which is a shame, I'm wondering if it's because of their close working relationship with Toyota/TRD or if they see the unlock as unethical by tuning industry standards or somthing. They claimed to have unlocked it years ago but nothing came about as I believe they were trying to encrypt their methods or whatever.

[RTPenland]

What I learned from them as an existing customer when I had a similar convo with them, this was over the phone so apologies mission if I didn't get everything right

Mission is all about controlling things end to end I’ve learned. If they can’t provide and control all aspects of a tune they won’t touch it. And by all aspects I mean, the unlock, the tuning delivery platform, the engine software, the transmission software, and now soon a custom tune. If they can’t have the “god view” into everything and offer a single point of contact to support it they won’t market it. I think they would do quite well if they offered their software on all platforms, but it doesn’t seem they want to go there.

The Toyota angle where they were hired to develop the TRD Supra software is an interesting one and like you I’m curious if that arrangement came with any golden handcuffs. I know they do a lot of white label software work so who knows what restrictions they operate under but I think all of us consumers benefit from it (I know I do lol). But certainly a feather in their cap to be hired by an OEM (one of things that first caught my attention)

While I am a huge mission fan I am a little disappointed I can’t run their performance tune on my wife’s latest car because it is just so damn good. My only option is a femto unlock and someone other than mission for a flash and I hope to avoid that

While they did unlock a 21+ back in the day for internal use, they were never able to bring it to market like femto(I hope this will change soon) and I know there were some IP concerns, so who knows. Given the fact that the 21+ unlock was one of the first “misses” for mission in over a decade I hold out hope while at the same time tip my hat to femto. That said mission was never about "mail in one time unlocks" so perhaps the challenge comes from an OBD/DME unlock that can be repeated by the user (I'm just speculating) like their mlink unlock tool

[Boosted6]

Great insight! Sux man...so ima go with a Botti custom tune instead-which from what i see and hear is up the same alley. I wish they would chime in as to the real reason-but we might never know.

[mike@x-ph.com]

not familiar with the details, buy why not go with bootmod3?

[Boosted6]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

not familiar with the details, buy why not go with bootmod3?

The map logic of their tune is oem plus, super smooth and really feels different. Just my preference.

[infinite_creations25]

Originally Posted by Boosted6

The map logic of their tune is oem plus, super smooth and really feels different. Just my preference.

Same here. I originally got MHD because I had a good experience on the n54 platform. However, on the b58tu platform, their OTS tunes just didn’t feel right to me. In addition to the 10d000 torque limiter codes that I kept getting, the power just wasn’t consistent. One of my biggest gripes was that in regular day to day driving, the car seemed to shift really early and bog badly. Flash back to the stock tune and the problems went away. I contacted MHD and pureboost in which they told me there’s nothing wrong. I finally decided to try the tune from mission performance and the difference is night and day. Drives just like OEM with much more power that was consistent and repeatable.

This is just my experience… maybe different for others.

[CarGuy954]

I understand mission performances concerns with all their work being copied by someone else if they release their DME unlock. However, that will take a little time and the amount of money they would acquire would be more than enough to cover their R & D, with quite a bit of profit. I think it's a bad strategy but, not my business. Its does make me feel that they are not in buisness for the BMW community, just for profits. However, the EPA has been jumping down tuning companies backs so maybe its not worth the headache down the road. I know that Cobb tuning had some push back from the EPA and took the initiative to not sell catless downpipes and agressive tuning. However, there is also the possiblilty that mission was just lying to stir the pot, who knows. Very disappointing and I hope someone else cracks the code because the FEMTO thing is just a big hassle.

[mike@x-ph.com]

I had conversations with different tuning companies, and they all said the same thing. It takes years of R&D to unlock the ECU, but it will take a month to reverse-engineer it once it's unlocked.

Given my work, I want this to happen more than anyone, as it will financially benefit me. But I have lived to accept that It will not happen, unfortunately.

[Rdurty2]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

I had conversations with different tuning companies, and they all said the same thing. It takes years of R&D to unlock the ECU, but it will take a month to reverse-engineer it once it's unlocked.

Given my work, I want this to happen more than anyone, as it will financially benefit me. But I have lived to accept that It will not happen, unfortunately.

FEMTO has been offering their unlocks for a while now. No one has reverse engineered it yet, that we know about.

I honestly don’t think anyone knows how to beat the encryption. My bet is FEMTO has an inside man at BMW with access to the decryption key.

[Boosted6]

Yup...inside person at the DME vendor (bosh was it?) It a monopoly right now and they are basically printing money. 30 years from now there will be a documentary about all of this- because everyone around the world (not just the USA) is sending their units for unlock. One heck of a Netflix documentary!

[SevenNine]

But now BMW can detect unlocked ECUs, flag them and void warranty, correct? Why did BMW choose to lock the ECU in the first place? I think it would smart move on their part to actually offer an official BWM flash tune and make a nice profit from it. Maybe it has something to do with government regulations. Another reason maybe why BMWs actually make more power than officially stated.

[prostcfc]

Originally Posted by SevenNine

But now BMW can detect unlocked ECUs, flag them and void warranty, correct? Why did BMW choose to lock the ECU in the first place? I think it would smart move on their part to actually offer an official BWM flash tune and make a nice profit from it. Maybe it has something to do with government regulations. Another reason maybe why BMWs actually make more power than officially stated.

Even though they can spot tunes and can void the warranty, I'm sure it's a headache for their service departments that they'd rather not deal with. Also government agencies going after aftermarket/tuners in general for offering devices that "bypass emissions", again, probably not worth the headache. I am surprised BMW doesn't offer an official tune though as a subscription. I'm sure there would be a lot of takers.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by Rdurty2

FEMTO has been offering their unlocks for a while now. No one has reverse engineered it yet, that we know about.

I honestly don’t think anyone knows how to beat the encryption. My bet is FEMTO has an inside man at BMW with access to the decryption key.

No one has access to it, and that's why Femto makes you send the DME to them.

Or else they would have charged dealers for unlocks like they used to do on previous chassis.

[GD1981]

Originally Posted by Boosted6

The map logic of their tune is oem plus, super smooth and really feels different. Just my preference.

I’ve got a Sameh tune on mine and the car just rocks.

OTS tunes for the most part are trash, as there are so many variables to consider when a car is being dialed in.

[dustwhyn]

Originally Posted by GD1981

I’ve got a Sameh tune on mine and the car just rocks.

OTS tunes for the most part are trash, as there are so many variables to consider when a car is being dialed in.

How are your cold starts on higher ethanol content levels? Like > E50? On the bm3 OTS maps they are absolute ass, but for some reason when I was on MHD my car would fire right up, even on straight E85.
I’m thinking about getting tuned by sameh when I get my Pure900 here soon.

[SevenNine]

Originally Posted by prostcfc

Even though they can spot tunes and can void the warranty, I'm sure it's a headache for their service departments that they'd rather not deal with. Also government agencies going after aftermarket/tuners in general for offering devices that "bypass emissions", again, probably not worth the headache. I am surprised BMW doesn't offer an official tune though as a subscription. I'm sure there would be a lot of takers.

I'm sure there are certain levels of headaches they are willing to deal with, especially when it comes to money.
I meant government agencies may not allow BMW to offer official flash tune. Because otherwise it doesn't make sense why BMW wouldn't offer it as option - it would be good additional business for them. I agree with you that they would have many customers, depending on price, additional power and the warranty it would come with.

[Davg31]

Femto is not the only one Aulitzy in Germany does it too

[Panscan340]

Originally Posted by Boosted6

Yup...inside person at the DME vendor (bosh was it?) It a monopoly right now and they are basically printing money. 30 years from now there will be a documentary about all of this- because everyone around the world (not just the USA) is sending their units for unlock. One heck of a Netflix documentary!

lol ok, think you’re vastly overestimating the demand for this service. I’m sure they’re doing well but it’s not like they’re doing thousands of units a day.

[Ruebarb]

Originally Posted by Davg31

Femto is not the only one Aulitzy in Germany does it too

Aulitzy is on premise unlock only, no mail in, not helpful to 99% of the BMW owners.

[Fudz]

DMS in the UK do an onsite unlock too. They need the car for 4 days though which i feel is strange and i would hazard a guess they are fast tracking the DME to Femto. I have an email saying they charge £950+VAT just for the unlock

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by Fudz

DMS in the UK do an onsite unlock too. They need the car for 4 days though which i feel is strange and i would hazard a guess they are fast tracking the DME to Femto. I have an email saying they charge £950+VAT just for the unlock

That is exactly what they are doing. Femto sends the DME back in the same day. takes 1 week from the US (3 days to get to Femto, 3 days back)

Within the UK it probably takes 2 days back and forth